The Striking Tree versus Turn 2

[lordparanoia]

T2 0click mode was totally e completely brainless. White Mages spammed Medica, Bards Had Ballad Up, Scholar used Succor / Wishpering Dawn. Dps just did their rotations. Totally No Strategy.
In Ramuh Extreme the only thing that changed was that you didn't need any tank and u lost ONE and ONLY ONE mechanic.
Honestly I don't agree with this choice. Nerfing Egis is making me think that Square Enix wants that all the Summoners use only Garuda.

[Shref]

T2 0click mode was totally e completely brainless. White Mages spammed Medica, Bards Had Ballad Up, Scholar used Succor / Wishpering Dawn. Dps just did their rotations. Totally No Strategy.
In Ramuh Extreme the only thing that changed was that you didn't need any tank and u lost ONE and ONLY ONE mechanic.
Honestly I don't agree with this choice. Nerfing Egis is making me think that Square Enix wants that all the Summoners use only Garuda.

it made it so that two classes were completely unneeded for the fight. how did you figure this was going to stand??
so if someone decided they didn't want to level a dps job, they're completely screwed out of the fight???
its not so much people taking an easy route as its people locking certain classes out of content.

[BloodPact]

it made it so that two classes were completely unneeded for the fight. how did you figure this was going to stand??
so if someone decided they didn't want to level a dps job, they're completely screwed out of the fight???
its not so much people taking an easy route as its people locking certain classes out of content.

As I just pointed in my previous post, with Titan-egi tanking Turn 2. This is not news. On top of that, excluding jobs is nothing new to this game as well. Did you forget when Garuda Extreme came out and no party anywhere would take melee because why risk a Wicked Wheel when you can 4 ranged the instance? I bet tanks didn't mind that too much as their two spots were secured back then. The selfishness shows (not attacking you, just speaking in a general, community sense).

[SeraviEdalborez]

Just saying, there was no reason Titan-tank should exclude players who only have tank jobs from Ramuh. Aside from just doing it the legit way, Tank DPS is not as low as people think it is, and it's as easy as dropping Defiance or being in Sword Oath.

I would argue the average pickup DPS is so lackluster at their rotation that tank DPS, being as easy as it is, is comparable or better.

[Codek]

As I just pointed in my previous post, with Titan-egi tanking Turn 2. This is not news. On top of that, excluding jobs is nothing new to this game as well. Did you forget when Garuda Extreme came out and no party anywhere would take melee because why risk a Wicked Wheel when you can 4 ranged the instance? I bet tanks didn't mind that too much as their two spots where secured back then. The selfishness shows (not attacking you, just speaking in a general, community sense).

Melee being excluded from Garuda was an odd issue. It was completely fabricated by the players going with a weird (and subjectively weaker) strategy of having one tank tanking two mobs. Had the groups properly learned how to have the DPS tank Chirada and manage downburst correctly, then melee dps would have been perfectly effective on that fight. I blame youtube on this one more then SE.

[Shref]

snip

the garuda example shows how fast the community flocks to the easy way out on fights, even when the fights aren't hard. garuda ex is still easy and often faster with melee, most melees would learn it relatively quick. T2 rot is laughably easy-people just refuse to do it even though its twice as fast. its a large part of why there's people who still can't do titan ex. they give themselves an easy out at every opportunity instead of learning the fights. just because they let it fly in the past doesn't mean they will for everything.

[Dwill]

Just saying, there was no reason Titan-tank should exclude players who only have tank jobs from Ramuh. Aside from just doing it the legit way, Tank DPS is not as low as people think it is, and it's as easy as dropping Defiance or being in Sword Oath.

I would argue the average pickup DPS is so lackluster at their rotation that tank DPS, being as easy as it is, is comparable or better.

Fully agreed. A paladin in Sword Oath and full strength accessories would deal a quite respectable amount of DPS so that he could actually finish the fight on the jobs he wants while actually contributing to the fight.

[MissE]

Not sure why people are even bringing up T2.
I can still bring one tank to T2 if there's no SMN, and it will still work. Now, try that with Ramuh.
The point is Titan-Egi can do something normal tanks can't, while in T2 they both work.

I do think people should stop using the "excluding the tanks" argument.
You can totally do it with 2 tanks and 4 DPS with Titan-Egi tanking, and you'll still have 6 people killing the adds.
Oh well, I guess you all already know how this community works, because you know people are going to get 6 DPS just to speed run the fight :/

[Taban]

I think it's funny how people are handwaving away T2's difficulty. T2 was probably the only "difficult" pre-Twin fight in old coil. It wasn't hard, but passing rot did take some coordination and time to learn. PUGs went almost overnight from only pugging T1 to pugging through T4. Honestly in terms of looking like an exploit T2 was much much worse than Ramuh.

[Alipoprocks]

Just saying, there was no reason Titan-tank should exclude players who only have tank jobs from Ramuh. Aside from just doing it the legit way, Tank DPS is not as low as people think it is, and it's as easy as dropping Defiance or being in Sword Oath.

I would argue the average pickup DPS is so lackluster at their rotation that tank DPS, being as easy as it is, is comparable or better.

Except that Ramuh was done with all summoners and healer(s).

I don't really have a position on this argument. But I do like that there is a way to do a fight that doesn't require a tank. I hope the titan-egi nerf didn't completely remove the ability to be creative.