There needs to be some kind of "Intentionally Uncooperative" vote kick option

[shape]

I tank and from a tanking point of view i would shoot the OT, who wasn't using his shield on the spot. Who knows maybe he thought he was a warrior(LMFAO). This doesn't just come under harassment its downright stupidity and makes him a fail tank.
Tanks need to ready for anything. MT dies some how, OT needs to take over. Him not having a shield means he wont be able to do this properly.
Every fight needs people to different things his one and only job was to stun every other eruption he failed and needs to go to tank school. All of the people who defended the OT not stunning ever other eruption don't ever be in a party with me. stunning erutions might drop my dmg by a tiny bit(shield bash does damage DUH) but it also increases every one else damage output, so whats more important me losing a tiny of damage or the overall group damage.

Maybe my priorities are wrong but i always thought for tanks its control the fight, stay alive, be aware of the overall situation and then lastly and damage done is a bonus. Guess the new style of tanking is reverse all this.

[Felessan]

It's must better for the control of the fight to stun eruptions and have a controlled, predictable radiant plume moment pattern. You can't stun all the eruptions in the fight because of his stun resistance anyway. But not trying at all because it'll lower group DPS is bs.

I always cry when I see sub-200 dps from DPS class. Should I vote kick them too for "not trying"?
Even though this PAL is arrogant it still understandable - why should he put more effort to easy other people life when it's really not required and is a bad habbit looking at further encounters. What all those ppl that can't manage eruptions will do on Ultima HM/Ifrit EX - cry a river?

And by the way - you can have "controlled, predictable radiant plume moment" even without stun, just all the party should pay attention and not stack on ifrit back too early.

[Dgsoil]

As for stunning errupitons and so on... and that effecting healers/dps... you are joking right? The half a second walk out of an erruption zone really isn't a big deal. And people need to learn you don't need to run across the field but just in a small circle where you are(you learn this on ultima hm eventually).

If this quote wasn't directed at me than my apologies.

I personally didn't say anything about needing stuns one way or the other, that wasn't my point at all, my point was that not even having a shield equipped was the dumb part. I don't care one way or the other about the stuns because Ifrit HM is fairly facerollable even at minimum ilvl usually. But going in missing a shield is pretty stupid just because he wanted to DPS, because as said having a shield doesn't negatively effect DPS of a PLD even an iota.

[Sapphic]

As for stuns and silences, sometimes they are a bigger help than other times.

Well not to mention not every stun can be interrupted, so players HAVE to dodge. Only ones that can be annoying, especially if heavy melee in party, is the ones post nails after the central plumes.

Those are only ones that should be interrupted, all others are easy to avoid just by stepping out of the area of the eruption But even those can be dodged too.

Pre-heart, no stuns are needed.

having a shield doesn't negatively effect DPS of a PLD even an iota.

Shields have STR, so not having one equipped negativelly impacts their DPS, albeit very minor, but still XD

[Dgsoil]

Shields have STR, so not having one equipped negativelly impacts their DPS, albeit very minor, but still XD

Indeed, that was exactly my point, not having one doesn't increase your DPS and in fact could negatively effect it. <3

[Launched]

You're all too hung up on Ifrit. What about tanks that move Titan around, or don't pick up any sisters in Garuda? What about Scholars that leave all the healing to the fairy even though their gear isn't good? What about a Summoner that only uses Ruin II and Titan, or a Dragoon that only uses the True Thrust combo? If someone isn't doing their job and won't listen to advice, you should be able to kick them.

[Alukah]

I always cry when I see sub-200 dps from DPS class. Should I vote kick them too for "not trying"?

Nothing to do with the topic. One thing is playing with a fresh lvl 50 DPS doing his relic quest, another thing is a paladin that deliberately decided to not use a shield / not help build LB which, depending on the party DPS, might actually be needed.

Even though this PAL is arrogant it still understandable - why should he put more effort to easy other people life when it's really not required and is a bad habbit looking at further encounters. What all those ppl that can't manage eruptions will do on Ultima HM/Ifrit EX - cry a river?

How is pressing one button putting more effort? I mean really, why do you think that fight requires two tanks if there are no adds?

And a strategy is not a bad habit. What is so wrong about following a strategy? What's the benefit of that PLD not using a shield/not stunning?[/QUOTE]

And by the way - you can have "controlled, predictable radiant plume moment" even without stun, just all the party should pay attention and not stack on ifrit back too early.

With people doing relic quest? Good luck with that.

[ispano]

And a strategy is not a bad habit. What is so wrong about following a strategy? What's the benefit of that PLD not using a shield/not stunning?

It's because that's the only place where it even works. I've seen people complain about eruptions not being stunned on Ifrit Extreme. People get used to thinking they don't need to dodge the eruptions at all, instead of using the opportunity to practice said dodging.

[Parodine]

And by the way - you can have "controlled, predictable radiant plume moment" even without stun, just all the party should pay attention and not stack on ifrit back too early.

In a DF situation, what are you more likely to achieve, a good movement pattern with use of stun or without? Hopefully that should be obvious.
I bring it up because for Ifrit HM you'll likely be working with a group of strangers (I haven't seen a PF for Ifrit HM in months), no one will explain anything at the beginning, and you'll be dependent on everyone knowing the vague way radiant plumes, charges, and eruptions work, how to move and their role. Proper stuns help facilitate this and make it easier as eruptions are arguably the most tricky thing since by the last phase they'll be spawning on 3 people. If you don't wanna stun them for the first 50% of the fight, I don't see a problem at all, but even a non-PLD can provide stun coverage against the last phase of eruptions as they're more timed and predictable.
That's all I'm trying to say.

Ifrit Ex is another thing entirely. And arguably, it's be better to practice dodging them specifically for that fight because you can't run all willy-nilly over the map to dodge them like for HM. You'll get more dodging practice in Ultima HM too.

[Sadana]

Trolling does fall under the harassment label. Problem is when 5 trolls come in a pre-made for the lols. /rollseyes. All you can do at that point is report them after you escape the fight/dungeon. BUT, here's the thing... dude refusing to use his shield? yeah no reason for that shit... someone using a different strategy to fight X monster? It may LOOK like they're trolling to the party to expects to do it a certain way, but they aren't. :/