The problem with allowing Turn 2 Rage strat

[Wizhard]

wow, this thread is STILL going on...


No it's not.

To be an exploit, you would need to either put ADS in a state where you would break his "AI" (He would not do anything) or place yourself in such a way where you would not receive damage.
The enrage method, while an unforeseen strategy by SE, is not exploiting any bugs or flaws in the game. Will this strategy be invalidated by changes to ADS in a future patch? Possible and when that will be the case, people will adapt but until then, the enrage strategy is a legitimate one, abet a bit original, since it does not exploit a flaw that would make ADS not damage the players.

Of course some of the people in this thread will continue to claim "It's an exploit" without any proof of it actually exploiting a flaw in the game.

Its not original, its cheap.

[Allyra]

Its not original, its cheap.

idk about that. I think my repair costs are about the same no matter which way I do it.

[Ceridan]

Its not original, its cheap.

ummm

o·rig·i·nal
əˈrijənl/Submit
adjective
adjective: original
1.
present or existing from the beginning; first or earliest.
"the original owner of the house"
synonyms: indigenous, native, aboriginal, autochthonous; More
2.
created directly and personally by a particular artist; not a copy or imitation.
"original Rembrandts"
synonyms: first, earliest; More
authentic, genuine, actual, true, bona fide;
informalkosher
3.
not dependent on other people's ideas; inventive and unusual.
"a subtle and original thinker"
synonyms: innovative, creative, imaginative, inventive; More

I think original is an adequate adjective for this strategy.
It's only cheap because you personally don't give any value to it. By that same logic, you think it's cheap to burn the boss on copperbell mine (last boss), burn the wall in AK, burn the 3rd boss in Pharos Sirirus, Ignore the plumes on garuda HM or any other method that ignore boss mechanic yet is valid because it does not attempt to exploit a bug in the game.

[Ceridan]

I can't get my head round why people are still arguing about this...the company that produces the game has come forward and addressed this saying that this is a valid tactic no ifs or buts. its there in black and white you cannot argue the fact. Disagree yes but you cannot say its an invlalid tactic anymore.


People saying you're not doing the fight properly unless you deal with Rot.... Well Rot is not THE mechanic in this turn its one of the potential mechanics you need to deal with. The entire instance is based on allowing you to customise the end encounter by removing certain mechanics you do or do not want to deal with. How is waiting and choosing not to deal with ROT but a room wide AOE that must be healed through any different.

So people believe enrage is easier than rot therefore it shouldn't be allowed, but hang on rot is easier than haste so by that logic does that mean the only proper way to do this encounter is by giving ADS the haste buff? i bet my house (figuratively) that no one would agree.

by allowing ADS to enrage you are choosing to do this encounter your way, you are not exploiting the game, ADS will still do an attack rotation that you have to deal with. The fact that people find this easier is irrelevant based onthe above logic.

My question is had the first groups that cleared this instance and provided the guides on how they did it use the enrage method would we still be having this pointles arguement? i highly doubt it as it would be this method that was adopted months ago as most people are sheep and follow the path someone else has already laid out for them that is shown to be successful.

I think peoples biggest issue here, cutting through the crap, is that they are concerned someone else might get that same shiney piece of digital loot in a way that is deemed easier and they didn't think of making them less special.

Quoted for truth.
I think this horse is beaten to death enough already.

[MilesSaintboroguh]

No let's keep beating it

[Hiroradius]

SE are defending it too by not calling it an exploit.

And yet they also called Dark Devices a working as intended and not an exploit, yet they FIXED that one. Then they state they never made any adjustments to it at all, AND to submit bug reports... Yeaaaa we can all trust SE to let us know something is an exploit or not... Only reason turn 5 and Titan were addressed so quickly was because it caused an actual game break, Titan caused people to easily get their relics and progress, and Turn 5 well that was end game lol you beat that with the exploit and the game is finished.

The enrage method IS an exploit, but it's not game breaking, just like Dark Devices, and VARIOUS other exploits (remember the AK exploit that was another working as intended, but was patched a couple of weeks later?). If it was game breaking they would address it immediately, but since it's not.. all that will happen is when they do correct it with a hidden fix(because they won't announce they fixed it) and suddenly people can not get past turn 2 even though those same people have been working turn 5, I'm just going to laugh, I know some people who actually claim they will quit the game if they fix this.

Oh and look at the forum posting EXPLOIT, you make a post and have a 1000 character liimit, yet you can edit your post and have no limit? Hmmmm exploit.

[Senchai]

... Sadly there is no thumbs down option here, really. I posted same in german forums already. Seems you guys really have no life. Why discuss this? Are you all aware that this is NOT THE ONLY fight in the game where one gets tested, right? Why in all names do YOU care about it if ppl get tested at Garuda Ex, Titan Ultimate Extreme or <insert anything here>?


OPs subjects:
-removes the opportunity for groups to learn and progress through this particular fight
Again, who cares. If the ppl that only (and i mean only) are able to kill it in this mode dont get further after T3 then whats the difference for YOU and the community? Whats the difference if they get tested here or in any other fight? Are you so alone in the game that you dont have ppl to do Coil or are you one of the ppl that cannot be in a team and so only depends on DF parties? Well, your problem then imo.

-for those not yet geared enough to complete turn 1, many are clearing this once a week for easy loot.
What? What you say makes no sense at all. So you think spending 2 more weeks in AK so they can buy AF2 makes ppl more skilled? Wth are you talking about lol.

-by not adjusting this dungeon it sends a message to the community that it's ok to use whatever means necessary to gather loot, the fight isn't what's important.
I didnt get that message, where is it? How it got delivered? In my inbox in gmail or where i have to look at it for? (sarcasm) ...

Hard to believe ppl still are arguing over this. Not sure what makes Turn 2 different from other fights...Why noone cares about T3 that is by far more in need to be fixed... Why noone cares if ppl run through here only through teleporting instead of fighting the mobs? And lol... who in all worlds said that SE didnt have an intention like this to have a fight beatable in more than one way? Imo there should be ALOT more machanics in the game than this single one, where there are different ways to beat certain things. Or are you so simple minded that this doesnt come to your mind?

Sometimes we beat normally, sometimes we use Raged mode. And? After that we clear t4... So what is it you talk about?

I know for sure that it bugs me alot more that the DF-level restriction of Primals is so low

Bah... not sure why i even spend time posting here...

[Allyra]

And yet they also called Dark Devices a working as intended and not an exploit, yet they FIXED that one.

Are you saying SE only makes changes to things that are exploits?

Silly brds exploiting RoD all those months!

[SilverRhythm]

Its not an exploit, its bad design. Enrage means if you don't kill it within the allotted time you lose. current ADS enrage means you can bypass all ADS mechanics, take 3 healers and automatically win, so all the work and effort put into ADS mechanics/design is out of the window, and turn 2 has turned into the new turn 3 but with free loot.

Tell developers that they should consider adjusting it not because its an exploit people are taking advantage of, but because ADS is a joke now and the fight mechanics are useless

Well said, I can't believe SE actually said that there is no plans to make any adjustments to Turn 2. Its just like SE hate admitting on their bad design. Anyways, if its a way of SE trying to keep their players in the game then so be it. Welcome to Turn 4 for those who have already surpassed ADS.

[Chronos]

I dunno why people cry about this...let the noobs get their gear. it's FASTER to do the fight as intended...let them go slow. gl on turn 6-10