Tanks Who Constantly Queue and Then Withdraw Trying to Get in Progress Instances

[Aenarion]

I think this is a dps issue more then anything. As a tank I never have this issue, as soon as I queue it almost instantly pops and I get in, I do not see this withdrawal thing people are talking about.

It is primarily for CT, to a lesser extend some of the other DFs.

[indira]

i have a problem with people who queue just fail on purpose.

[Kaedan94]

The join in progress should limit itself to only join in progress. If your going to punish people for using this system then they will simply stop using it and the moment you actually need to have someone fill in the spot youll find nobody.

Again, this is not a satisfactory solution. While I completely agree there should be a separate "Join In-progress Only" button, they also need to have the current system as well for people who are willing to help out those abandoned mid-dungeons, but are also willing to just start a new dungeon, whichever comes first. And for that case, there needs to be a deserter penalty for clicking Withdraw excessively (and IMO should be followed up with bans for repeat offenders).

[juniglee]

As it's been mentioned, the solution should never be to punish players who want an in-progress party. There should be a separate queue. This is the better solution.

Players can have a multitude of reasons for exclusively joining in-progress, including desiring CT loot near the end of that dungeon. Again, the more appropriate solution in this instance is to delay all loot until the very end; Acheron should reward 4 pieces, instead of having each mini-boss reward 1. Most of the reason why people leave early is because they received their weekly loot allotment. Allowing players to join in-progress benefits all sides involved. Some people want the mythology tomes at the end. Regardless of their reasoning, everyone should have the freedom to join a party with the progress they desire.

As it is though, in lieu of an immediate fix, having to sit through withdrawn queues is the price that less-desired jobs will simply have to pay. If you want to be able to pick and choose among duty results, then you should play as a tank.

People need to complain less about the frustrations of long queues and supposed "abuse" of withdrawals, and start playing as tanks (and healers, to a lesser extent).

I am not looking to punish each and every player attempting to join in-queue. I am looking to punish each and every player abusing the in-progress queue as a quick means to gain fast Mythology, or snipe specific bosses in CT for loot. I really don't know how much my definition differs from other people - for all I know I could be the only naive idiot in the world who thinks so, but the in-progress queue is intended for players to fill up missing roles, so that people who are left hanging in dungeons can finish their dungeons without having to start over again. I really doubt the intention of the in-progress queue is for people to snipe bosses, and gain easy rewards.

"To hell with those people stuck in queues I say, I'm not helping them unless they're at the last boss. They're not worth my time otherwise."

Acheron rewarding 4 pieces is really no different. What's stopping me from sniping until I see only Acheron remains? I can skip Bone Dragon, Thanatos, and King Behemoth in this manner, and have even less incentive to queue a full dungeon/more incentive to snipe for Acheron.

You'll also notice that the people who are doing said boss sniping are almost usually tanks. Being a tank does not give you a free admission to being a douche towards 3/7/23 other players. Being a tank does not instantly give me the right to snipe dungeons, at the expense of other players' queue times.

[Billie21]

I just wonder why the game lets you know what you are about to enter (full dungeon or in-progress, and if the later it even tells you what's the state of progress) along with the possibility to withdraw, if they didn't intend to let you choose.

Every time I had people withdrawing after a full party is assembled, it took me less time queueing until next full party is formed, which is why I don't believe it puts you back at the end of the queue.
But, since I never ran any kind of test or whatever measurements are possible to support this theory, I can't say for sure.
If that is not the case, the game should indeed keep your party at the top of the queue whenever some members are withdrawing.

The only problem that I see with this whole topic is what Boo (and some others probably) mentionned: the fact that while the "commence" window pops up repeatedly, you cannot engage in any other activity.

They really need to start banning them. I main a PLD and it sickens me when this crap happens if I'm on another job. It's incredibly rude and needs to be punished.

My suggestion is this: Allow two withdraws from queue. On the third strike, the person withdrawing takes a 30 minute penalty. It then also flags the system that said person has received the withdrawing penalty. Once that person receives 3 flags, they are then banned for a shortish period of time (say 3 days). Then it will progressively get longer.

Keep in mind, I'm talking about withdrawing from the queue, not once you've entered a dungeon (which there's already a penalty for). If you've ever had it happen where your queue pops over and over for short periods, it's a Tank constantly queuing and withdrawing trying to get an in-progress dungeon so they can more quickly get their Myth tokens.

It happened to me a couple of times, not for very long (like 2 minutes). Group formed, then one or several members withdraw.
It also happened to me a couple of times to queue as tank, finding a party, then every time I click on "accept" for some reason (bug?) DF rejects me (exactly as if I had withdrawn instead of accepted).

Therefore am firmly against such a proposal.

Add an "in-progress only" option could be a good idea though.
And again, if it's not already the case, a party formed that has members withdrawing, should be kept at the top of the queue, not put back at the end.
Personnally, I wouldn't be opposed to a "blind queueing" either, since it's pretty much how I'm already using the DF. Though I can't speak for the rest of the players.

[Kaedan94]

I am not looking to punish each and every player attempting to join in-queue. I am looking to punish each and every player abusing the in-progress queue as a quick means to gain fast Mythology, or snipe specific bosses in CT for loot. I really don't know how much my definition differs from other people - for all I know I could be the only naive idiot in the world who thinks so, but the in-progress queue is intended for players to fill up missing roles, so that people who are left hanging in dungeons can finish their dungeons without having to start over again. I really doubt the intention of the in-progress queue is for people to snipe bosses, and gain easy rewards.

"To hell with those people stuck in queues I say, I'm not helping them unless they're at the last boss. They're not worth my time otherwise."

Acheron rewarding 4 pieces is really no different. What's stopping me from sniping until I see only Acheron remains? I can skip Bone Dragon, Thanatos, and King Behemoth in this manner, and have even less incentive to queue a full dungeon/more incentive to snipe for Acheron.

You'll also notice that the people who are doing said boss sniping are almost usually tanks. Being a tank does not give you a free admission to being a douche towards 3/7/23 other players. Being a tank does not instantly give me the right to snipe dungeons, at the expense of other players' queue times.

Exactly. I really hate how some of the people in this thread conveniently "don't read" and leave out important aspects of the proposed ideas and instead misrepresent them when they argue. As some others have mentioned, it appears that most of the people arguing against a penalty for abusers are the very same ones that are abusing the system.

[Alkimi]

But the fix is simple:

>> Blind Queuing <<

Don't allow "in-progress" seeking players to know the dungeon progression before they enter the instance.

If a tank is paired with a 'Start from the beginning" Party and doesn't like it, he'll have to take the penalty when he leaves.

Pretty much this. I've no idea why there's 28 pages of bizarre suggestions for progressive penalties and seperate queues when this is the easiest possible solution.

The other method of *blind entering* is not a good one *in my opinion*. I never liked this in WoW, and you can often times skip a boss you might have either wanted loot or philo tomes from. This also can happen when queuing as a full group keep in mind, and could screw a lot of people (including DD/heals) out of gear.
.

That's just a risk you take for ticking the in progress box. If you want an earlier drop in the dungeon, just don't tick it.

[gadenp]

For me, I really want to play DPS but somehow DPS takes 1 hour, and PLD takes 5 minutes.

I love to join Party in Progress, because as mentioned, you get to skip parts of the dungeon. But ... If a standard dungeon pops, I see no issue to go in. Actually more like ethics and integrity.

Sadly in this world, especially in game, ethics and integrity can lapse. So people that do this, in game, what more will they be in real life. Oh they will cover it better, but seriously... will act similar or the same.

Anyways, cannot be helped, with the way the game is setup and the world as it is. Just have to live with it. Roll a tank and do not do it to others.

Only thing developers can do, it is if you cancel party join 3 times within xx minutes, you cannot join for xx minutes. Actually will help alot.

[Kinseykinz]

Make 2 queues, if you don't like the longer queues then roll a tank or suck it up.

As it's been mentioned, the solution should never be to punish players who want an in-progress party. There should be a separate queue. This is the better solution.

Players can have a multitude of reasons for exclusively joining in-progress, including desiring CT loot near the end of that dungeon. Again, the more appropriate solution in this instance is to delay all loot until the very end; Acheron should reward 4 pieces, instead of having each mini-boss reward 1. Most of the reason why people leave early is because they received their weekly loot allotment. Allowing players to join in-progress benefits all sides involved. Some people want the mythology tomes at the end. Regardless of their reasoning, everyone should have the freedom to join a party with the progress they desire.

As it is though, in lieu of an immediate fix, having to sit through withdrawn queues is the price that less-desired jobs will simply have to pay. If you want to be able to pick and choose among duty results, then you should play as a tank.

People need to complain less about the frustrations of long queues and supposed "abuse" of withdrawals, and start playing as tanks (and healers, to a lesser extent).

No, there should NOT be 2 cues.

Look again, and I don't know how to make this more clear:

Join in Progress IS NOT, a speed to the end/get to skip a boss or 2 card. It was NEVER intended to used for such purposes or intended to be a 'skip' button. It was a 'sure, I don't mind helping' button. It was actually intended to help out groups who got stuck or abandoned. Therefore, there should NOT be 2 cues. Because the reality is you should always plan on starting from the beginning of any Duty you join. That is how each dungeon was intended to be played. So no, there should not be 2 cues because the whole point of 'Join In Progress', which is to HELP others, is lost then.

And putting all the 'loot' at the end, solves nothing. Then people will spam until they see 2/3 or 3/4 ...because after all, loot is only at the end right?

At that point, if they give 2 cues, they might as well allow people to select which point they wish to start from:

Beginning:
After 1st Boss:
After 2nd Boss:
etc...

Because THAT is how the 'withdraw' players are treating it anyway...so might as well give everyone the option. This way you could even form your own party to spam the boss of your desires for faster loot, leave and do it again. That's what people want right?

Heck, lets go further...just give us the option to once a week buy a cap of myth tomes or that one drop in CT you wanted with real life gil. Because again, time is too precious to actually rely on clearing a dungeon from beginning to end...let alone farm the dungeon. Just let me buy what I want and look cool and be done with it....

/sarcasm off

If anything, they should just get rid of your right as a player to select where you get placed if using DF and randomly assign everyone to a group, regardless of whether it is in progress or starting fresh, and NOT let you see where you are (beg/middle/end) until you actually enter...sorta like how Dungeon Roulette only shows you what Duty you rolled once you enter and the CS plays. This way, by default those who are trying to 'farm for a better start' would HAVE to take the 30 minute 'abandon' penalty and this behavior would mostly stop.

[Tridus1x]

They need to separate the in progress queue in order to fix the problem. Any other suggestion is ignorant and childish and spawned out of pure entitlement. That 3 day ban? Ha! What a joke. The emotions of a child crying when they don't get their way.

News flash- That 3 day ban means that nobody gets the tank that wanted to queue, so you are hurting other players experience in order to cater to your own. Pathetic OP.