Can we please get separate stat allocations for SMN/SCH?

[P_Wing]

The idea of classes and jobs are that if you level one character to 50, you can play 1 end-game role with that character. This is true for other jobs (PLD, WHM, BLM, ...) and I don't see why you should complain over this idea.

I played THM/BLM to 50 for DPS role and I thought I wanna have one more healer, so I played another SCH. Would it be fair if you can play only ACN to 50 and get both roles with half my effort?

[Bladeglory]

I just can't see a DD coming from GLD with abilities like Flash, Provoke, Shield Bash.......

Level 30 Job Skill: Antipathy
Uses 400MP to convert one quarter of your enmity into damage. CD of 20 seconds.

Or something like that. The Job would rely on your attacks building too much enmity and needing to mete and expend it intelligently. Make it the best enmity builder in the game... but with DD or healer defenses.

[Mcshiggs]

Dungeons will grant more XP than FATEs in 2.1, and since everyone is absolutely sick of FATE grinding... I'll let you do the math. Also, let me know the minimum number of turn-ins I'll need for 10k GC Seals.

With crafting and gathering classes at level 50, hq supply and provisioning turn ins give over 500 seals each, over 800 if they have a star next to them that day. People are complaining there is no use for crafting, here is one right here. You can also do GC leves, or the turn ins from the level 50 dungeons give around 150 seals each. What they need to do is make the Hymns sellable, so those of us that can spend a couple hours and get one can sell them to the lazier people.

It would be easy to work dps classes into gladiator and marauder, right now gladiator basically has 2 combos, but rage of halone is the primary one, just make a job ability a weaponskill that combo's off of riot blade, then you still have 4 more job abilities for other attacks/abilities that increase damage and give it it's own identity.

[Tupsi]

BOO THIS MAN! BOOOOOOOOOO!!!!! ( I mean Yoshida, not Hvinire )

This kind of stance discourages players from leveling and playing multiple jobs which stem from the same class.

No it doesn't.

perform as best as I can when I play a job in FF

I'll let you in on a secret - Most jobs in FF games are all basically the same with different iterations of their main talents. For example there's two styles of summoner yet they summon the same pets, one has a different effect aside just a big attack. You can perform the best at the job you choose, the problem with ARR is the attribute system in terms of gear is pretty bland which makes it "harder" to match up those missing 15 points but don't let needing the full 30 points fool you - I've seen terrible full 30 MND SCH and amazing 15 MND SCHs.

[KraggyKor]

We are all entitled to our opinion but I like it the way they have done it. If they allowed us to switch out our stats whenever we want, then what's the point of having the bonus stats in the first place, they should just take that away and add those points to the job itself.

I like having the freedom to choose and set these stats the way I want, and not have to change them every time I change my class, or have them change with the job. But that's my opinion.

Ya, it sucks for min/maxers but I play both SCH/SMN regularly, without issue.

Freedom to gimp both jobs is fine, however most people would prefer to spec. to be the best they can be so they don't gimp their parties and as such this split means such players will only ever play one or the other; it's a crass class/job design mechanic.

And yes, there IS an 'issue' when you party with others, they suffer.

[Noriega]

Hello all,

As Yoshida mentioned in a previous LIVE letter, these two jobs were planned to share stats and there are currently no plans to separate their stat allocations. When leveling each class, we'd like players to carefully consider how you'd like to allocate your earned stats. Of course, there is an item that allows you to reset them should you decide to move in a different direction, but it's something that takes time to acquire.

That why they should have put SMN with THM as a second job. Since, y'know, that would make sense.


The point of the game was not only to have a choice of how one trains a character, but being able to play multiple characters on a single player. At this points, its impossible, and that goes doubly for SMN/SCH. The stat points, as mentioned through out beta, was unnecessary because they did not do anything other than restrict what a player is able to do, though it was toted as "extra customization"

Now that we see its a farce, we're now giving the whole "be careful" because we really do not have much choice in the game when it comes to character customization.

Even if you get 2 jobs for leveling 1 class (which is not exactly true since a SMN requires a THM, and a SCH needs CNJ),

Unlocking requirement and usefulness are two different things. So although you may choose one or the other job, they would still be dipping into other classes for useful skills. In the case of SCH, they utilize both CNJ and THM.

Which further makes the state allocations bothersome, since they require to opposite spectrum classes to maximize a jobs potential.

they still use completely different gear sets, so you still have to pick 1 class and its not like you can switch back and forth, without completely getting a new set of gear (just like any other 2 jobs), so its definitely 2x the world for having 2 jobs.

Irrelevant. You can get multiple gear sets.

I am guessing the main factor behind the "decision" was it was too difficult to program otherwise, or time consuming to implement. There doesn't seem to be much logic in gimping 2 of the 9? jobs in the game

There really wasnt any reason to join those two in the first place. People already saw that stat allocation in this particular instance would be detrimental to class and job choice but were deemed "haters" and "wow kids" because logic.

I would love to see how they do the other jobs but so far, i cant see how ARC wouldnt be a unique situation unless archer gets a non dex job (which would be akin to ARC and SMN), PUG gets a non STR job, Tanks gets Dex jobs, THM gets a heal based Job that has beans for MP, and CNJ gets a tank job or a dps job that cant use cleric stance.

But obviously im just another hater.

[xanj]

BOO THIS MAN! BOOOOOOOOOO!!!!! ( I mean Yoshida, not Hvinire )

This kind of stance discourages players from leveling and playing multiple jobs which stem from the same class. I have SCH/SMN at 50 but I only play SCH because I don't want to split half of my bonus stats into a worthless stat, or settle for a secondary stat. Inb4 I'm labeled "hardcore" or "vocal minority", or any other buzzword cop-out for wanting to perform as best as I can when I play a job in FF.

you could just go 30 vit because heath is a big thing in turn 5, but to be honest the bonus stats dont matter much its the tomes that you have to choose between spending on one or the other that are important

[Mcshiggs]

I would love to see how they do the other jobs but so far, i cant see how ARC wouldnt be a unique situation unless archer gets a non dex job (which would be akin to ARC and SMN), PUG gets a non STR job, Tanks gets Dex jobs, THM gets a heal based Job that has beans for MP, and CNJ gets a tank job or a dps job that cant use cleric stance.

But obviously im just another hater.

I'm gonna go ahead and guess that the second job from each class will benefit from a different main stat than the current one, Conjurer getting like Geomancer that uses earth shields to be a tank, pugilist turning either into healing dancer type, benefitting from mind, or maybe something more interesting, puppetmaster, using ranged pets, since the pet's stats come from the player's, players could decide to go str to boost their damage, dex to benefit their pet, or a combo to balance them.
With pvp coming out there will be people that allocate points specifically for that.

[KariArisu]

Hello all,

As Yoshida mentioned in a previous LIVE letter, these two jobs were planned to share stats and there are currently no plans to separate their stat allocations. When leveling each class, we'd like players to carefully consider how you'd like to allocate your earned stats. Of course, there is an item that allows you to reset them should you decide to move in a different direction, but it's something that takes time to acquire.

Thanks for confirming that I will never bother playing Summoner until I have 99 Hymns to reset with.
The problem is that the stat allocations are so binary that it makes no sense to share them.
SMN is 30 INT, SCH is 30 MND. Anything else is pretty much pointless.

[Fadigre]

If I sound like I'm about to burst a vessel it's just down to a lack of Elezen blood passing through my lips. bear with me.


It may also be down to the fact that after countless posts regarding the topic and the system clearly not being suitable to this game, Enix have the nerve to continue with 'working as intended'. I'm furious not because this exists, not because the reasons are completely ridiculous and not because you wrote to us Hvinire.

I'm brimming with fury because this reads as Enix have re-evaluated the current system and have continued with what's already in place without addressing any player concerns whatsoever. I know that I myself am nothing special but as a community, I feel we have been ignored.
For no good reason at all.

--The future and additional jobs--

Maybe that's because every other class only has one job associated with it right now, while Arcanist has two. Arcanists have to make a choice between wanting to be a Summoner or a Scholar; and guess what, when a damage-dealer job for the Gladiator gets released, Gladiators have to decide between being a Paladin and being whatever the DD job is, and Conjurers will eventually have to decide between White Mage and whatever DD job that gets released for them.

The bonus attributes do have a point, it's just that most of the players don't utilize it because every class but one doesn't yet have to make a choice between multiple roles.

This kinda... I don't mind so much with SCH and WHM because I don't heal very often. For something I don't put as much time into as my tanking or my damage roles, I can deal with restrictions.

But how long will it be until I'm also effected? Hell hath no fury when the entire community has this problem and not just Arcanists.
And what about if Arcanist were ever to have 3 jobs instead of 2?

Simply being in a comfortable spot and playing ignorant to others however does not make this okay. Regardless whether this was 30 MND or 3 MND, it's still reducing player's freedom. Isn't that what this game is supposed to be about? The freedom to do everything? 10 years ago if you ever told me that the big burly race could be a spellflinger, I’d wet the bed!

I can only see more problems down the line. 7 classes, 10 jobs and I'll have to choose between even more roles. This game seems to consistently contradict itself with its ability to level all classes yet inability to gear and stat them accordingly.

--Understanding--

Probably the most frustrating part of this is Yoshida's reasoning.

Hello all,

As Yoshida mentioned in a previous LIVE letter, these two jobs were planned to share stats and there are currently no plans to separate their stat allocations. When leveling each class, we'd like players to carefully consider how you'd like to allocate your earned stats. Of course, there is an item that allows you to reset them should you decide to move in a different direction, but it's something that takes time to acquire.

What does that even mean? That I should half the points for each job?
How does this help me to consider my points?
I'll tell you what it does help me consider. It helps me consider putting my points into a stat completely unrelated to my job because of artificial limitations!

How can that possibly be a reason? Why would I pay more attention to my stats now that they're over two jobs? I don't know what Enix were thinking but the logic does not apply to anything bipedal.

Remember when Enix decided to nerf Miner and Botanist experience points rates to stop the market being flooded with materials on release?
Remember what happened?
The markets flooded with materials because players had to gather for a longer period of time to get to the same level.

This attribute distrution problem smells of the same scent. Was there any thought process done here?

All this does is encourage people to either half-distribute gimping both jobs out of 15 points which is a huge amount considering most gear upgrades are about 5 points or full-spec in one job and leave the other gathering dust.
This methodology is absurd!

Part of me wants to be blindly loyal, I trust the team know what they're doing.
However I can't help feel that this is being completely overlooked.

similar to how somebody didn't do the maths behind enhancing Warrior's HP by 20% but only enhancing heals received by 15%... with maximum stacks of Fury!

There is no argument here, there are no other viewpoints to see this from.
There is no sensible reason to keep things the way they are.
No reason at all!

-Ring ring-
Hello?
Hello sir, I'm calling to speak to Reason.
I'm sorry, there is no Reason here.

This makes no sense.
Who in the design team went out of their way to do this? Or should I say didn't put the effort in to change this.
Are they still employed?

Why?

--Usability--

Yes I can reset my points but the usability is disgraceful.
If you're dying to go down this path, please enhance the experience!

I shouldn't have to leave my coil party to go to town, pick up a lousy book, use the lousy book, redistribute my stats and then go back to Wineport.

At the very least Enix, let us spend our seals in the attribute point screen to reset them.
Even better, let us save pre-sets of our attributes points and just flip between them at a cost.
Reapplying all 30 points Every. Single. Time. Is ludicrous and completely vulnerable to future content. What about when if we have 60 points in the future?

What then, huh?
What then?

--Needless entitlement rant--

Why are we allowed to accept that melee classes are underperforming against casters by giving them a 10% damage boost, yet not allowed to accept that people who love pet classes either have to spend time gathering seals and goof around travelling between cities for no good reason at all besides the fact that Enix simply deem it to be?

If I understand correctly, FFXIV 1.0 had income 10x what it is now to make sure that arrows were affordable at 1 gil from a vendor. The game's currency was essentially based around making sure Archer and Bard could function without little trouble.

Although as time went on, Enix felt that the need to buy consumables for one class was not necessary and since removed arrows and reduced the game's gil by 90%.

So Archer and Bard can have their needless money making busy-work removed yet pet classes have to grind their foreheads against the whetstone to make sure that they're up to par with their colleagues?

Most illogical.

--In conclusion--

Current stat allocation is a frail, illogical short-term system that causes some jobs to participate in pointless busy work to stay on par with other jobs.
General consensus - Playerbase feels this decision is unfair