random Duty Finder groups - Square Enix attitude solution INC

[Jynxii]

I'm glad someone understood my point, it can cause issues from those who feel their loyalty to friends or a group is being looked down on by SE.

Not to mention the psychological strain on the individual player (cognitive dissonance), or the social strain on such friend groups and networks.

The system will probably end up going through, but I hope they have some system in place that also rewards players that support their LS/FC/Friends. I wonder if a system was put in place that rewarded running as an FC/LS, would people that didn't run in such a manner, and did random groups instead, oppose to a separate system like this? Now they're 'forced' to support their FC/LS otherwise they miss out on minions/mounts etc.

Might actually be worth putting together a post/letter for Yoshi and the team about the psychological effects of cognitive dissonance, forcing friend groups apart, and all that other jazz.

[kirottu]

So you can no longer play with your friends? Otherwise you will never receive these points and be able to use them.

[KaiKatzchen]

Not to mention the psychological strain on the individual player (cognitive dissonance), or the social strain on such friend groups and networks.

The system will probably end up going through, but I hope they have some system in place that also rewards players that support their LS/FC/Friends. I wonder if a system was put in place that rewarded running as an FC/LS, would people that didn't run in such a manner, and did random groups instead, oppose to a separate system like this? Now they're 'forced' to support their FC/LS otherwise they miss out on minions/mounts etc.

Might actually be worth putting together a post/letter for Yoshi and the team about the psychological effects of cognitive dissonance, forcing friend groups apart, and all that other jazz.

I agree with you 100% on all aspects.

There are some who only play this game because of a group of friends, and maybe they talked that person into playing because they knew they could do everything together. They may not feel comfortable doing it with strangers, but now they are felt out of something (getting points for items etc) because doing it with their friends isn't good enough?



There should be some kind of recognition for being a friendly kind player that helps it's own, which is why we make up LS's and FC's. If they do impliment this and people enter a DF with people all from the same server, same LS or same FC there should be some kind of point or randomized voting equivalent given to them for supporting their own server.

In all honestly I have been against DF since it's inception, and I believe that it support's an anti-community outlook. No longer do people have to be polite, help people on their server and keep up a good reputation among them. No, now you can just queue and unlucky people have to deal with their attitudes and elitist thinking and players and proceed though the game. There is no responsibly held for people and their actions in this game, and because the DF is cross server and random it's hard to avoid those who do have bad reputations.

As for your last comment, that might be a good idea. Too bad we aren't on the same servers, it would be a pleasure to meet you in game.

[KaiKatzchen]

So you can no longer play with your friends? Otherwise you will never receive these points and be able to use them.

Pretty much, if you want to support your friends/LS/FC then you're out of luck. You get nothing for being a helpful, supportive person in that aspect.

[Fyrebrand]

I love this idea! It has real potential. :-)
So, is this a confirmed thing that the devs said they are going to implement? I'm a little unclear on whether this is an official thing or if it's just the OP's suggestion.


Ha ha ha, is it terrible that my first instinct was to be pessimistic and search for flaws that could be exploited? But it seems pretty solid, since nobody can up-vote their friends, and there's no down-vote. My only concerns are:
1) It might get people to actually play nice in the dungeon in hopes of getting MVP points, but there's nothing to encourage them to actually give out points. If they are aiming for some exclusive mount or gear and want to feel like a special snowflake, they almost have an incentive not to vote anyone else up. This could possibly be controlled by putting a cap on how many up-votes you can receive before you have to give some more out. Even so, once a player has been through the system and gotten what they want out of it, they have no incentive to keep voting others up.
2) Everyone will up-vote the tank or healer, provided they are halfway decent. If DPS is doing its job, they pretty much don't stand out at all. :-S
3) I assume they thought of this, but the votes have to happen only after the dungeon is completed, and they should be anonymous. Maybe even delay the point allocation so that they are all tallied up at the end of the week, so you have no idea who voted you up or not.
4) Don't let players "forget" to up-vote their teammates. Have a window pop up at the end of every dungeon, which does not disappear until the player either up-votes someone from their group or opts out.

Seeing that you cannot up-vote people that you queue with or friends that you enter with, they are punishing players for being loyal to a group and friends. How is it fair to people that have very nice, friendly LS/FC's who like to do runs with their group and help their group get though DF runs?

I really don't see this being an issue. There are still a billion reasons to play with your friends/FC, and nobody needs an incentive to be a team player within those communities. It just happens naturally, and will continue to happen.
If your friends/FC refuse to play with you anymore because they're just out for MVP points, chances are they will have a hard time getting those points at all, and won't be missed anyhow.

[Bulwyf]

My problems with this and several have touched on it:

1. This utterly punishes people who usually group with friends. You will receive almost no votes if you routinely group with friends and no matter how good you are if some random players sees you have very few if any upvotes they will think you are a griefer and leave the instance.

2. This does not do anything to address the major issues of some players who intentionally screw up instances to get people killed or go AFK in an instance. There must be some kind of feature to /kick people out AND to invite someone into an instance.

3. There should be a downvote. The way to stop griefers is to make public how someone votes. If all a griefer does is downvote others on purpose it would show and other players would be warned to avoid this player.

[Felis]

Make repairs purchaseable with mvp tokens and this would work

Why waste MVP points on something that is cheap like dark matters?

[Alhanelem]

this, again, simply creates a stagnant community by excluding players whom make mistakes or new players with no experience

if you want your community to grow, you must encourage players to learn from mistakes and include new players with no experiance and not exclude them

It doesn't create a stagnant anything. If you don't want to be paired with jerks, don't be a jerk and you'll get more karma. Also, as I said, it won't prevent a match if there are only just enough people for a party- it will still form parties with anyone, only favoring similar karma scores if it's possible. Thus, you're very likely to have oppertunities to improve your behavior.

The only reason to be opposed to this idea is because you're a toxic player. Riot Games has done extensive research on the topic of toxic players, and they have developed systems that promote friendly behavior and reduce toxic behavior in a community known for being extremely toxic.

[jbizzi]

snip

This is why you have to be negatively impacted somehow by being a jerk. This whole "everyone gets a participation award" world that we live in, does not work. If you act like a jerk you will get penalized NEGATIVELY and those that act in accordance or politely will be affected POSITIVELY. Those that wish to group with only friends, will not be affected at all, their status will remain neutral while erring on the positive side until jerkiness proves otherwise.

Anyone else hungry for some jerky right now?

[Exn]

Seems like a pretty flimsy and not-well-thought-out solution.

This will just quickly become "I'll +1 YOU, if you +1 ME.." making it even more meaningless than it already was..

Not to mention the myriad of other points ppl have made in this thread exposing this idea's many, many flaws..