The current battle system mainly calculate everything from Your Rank vs Mob Rank

[Lerris]

didn't you notice about how much you get stronger when you rank up? that's a proof

It's proof that rank has a noticeable effect. Not proof that rank is the primary factor.

[Rentahamster]

It's proof that rank has a noticeable effect. Not proof that rank is the primary factor.

Take two players, one at rank 45, the other at rank 50. Give them the same exact stats and gear. You'll see a big difference.

[Peregrine]

Take two players, one at rank 45, the other at rank 50. Give them the same exact stats and gear. You'll see a big difference.

At this pont, rent...do you really think that?
They won't see a damn thing lol...

[Kurokikaze]

Take two players, one at rank 45, the other at rank 50. Give them the same exact stats and gear. You'll see a big difference.

Exactly. And this is the only MMO you can actually make that test on and it being completely valid... Why? Because rank doesn't determine your stats. Take off all your armor, use the same weapon, lower your stats down to basic starter stats, and compare yourself to someone of the same race (because you wouldn't want that omg 1 stat difference to skewer your results) and check for yourself.

Go ahead and try what Rentahamster suggested and you'll see the difference.

If DLVL or DRNK wasn't as big a factor as we tell you it is then the following will happen:

No damage difference.

But we know thats not the case.

[Physic]

Take two players, one at rank 45, the other at rank 50. Give them the same exact stats and gear. You'll see a big difference.

dlevel effects fights, noticeably so, but is it the only factor? is it to large a factor? in games made without dlevel they simply scale stats to accomodate, in fact this game is in reality one of the more forgiving in terms of how survivable you are versus high level monsters not many games where you when fighting a monster that is 20 levels higher than you, that you stand a chance.
normally a game would just make level 1 weapon = 1 dmg and level 100 weapon =1000 damage.

the point of the above, is no one is mad that mobs 20 levels higher than them can kick thier ass, or that someone 5 levels higher than them take less damage and deal more, they are mad that their percieved stats arent as effective as they want them to be.
that doesnt have much to do with dlevel.


I have already found with data, that gear choice effects your damage. i have found that this effect extends to fighting things up 28 levels higher.
if you are noticing no gain in damage when fighting anything from 1-28 levels higher than you, you can be sure that is not caused by dlevel.

If you just want stats to be the only factor, they can do that, but they will just distribute dlevel into the stats of mobs and players so it has a similar effect, and in the end it will just mean you will need even higher numbers to see a difference, and in all likely hood the game will either be unplayable without the latest gear at all times (if they distribute the level differences into gear) or you will need really large number bonuses to see any effect from gear (if they distribute the stats directly to the player)

but at the end of the day, until you have real equations, it is impossible to see what is really going on.

[Kurokikaze]

dlevel effects fights, noticeably so, but is it the only factor? is it to large a factor?

THIS IS WHAT PEOPLE HAVE BEEN SAYING FOR 10 FUCKING PAGES.

Lemme spell it out.

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[Physic]

so what do you think the difference in the game over all would be if they had no dlevel equations. What im getting at is, yall want change but ill tell you right now, you can distribute the dlevel formula to player stats or gear and monster stats and generate the exact same effects, so since its the effects you dont like, what exactly would you want to see happen in your perfect world of rpgs with levels and stats and gear.

for example right nowe my level 42 pug can hit a level 70 gobbue for 25 a hit, for a total of 50 a round. the gobbue hits me for 1400.
what would you expect a person wearing the right gear for that level to be able to do, and damage they can take from a mob that high
what effect would you expect a person in +3 gear to be like in a similar situation.

put down to a regular fight versus a mob 10 levels higher than you

what% of your hp should a mob do versus a normal player, an hq player.

since no one knows how stats work right now, lets speak in terms of output. that may actually be valuable to people programming things.

[SuzakuCMX]

so what do you think the difference in the game over all would be if they had no dlevel equations. What im getting at is, yall want change but ill tell you right now, you can distribute the dlevel formula to player stats or gear and monster stats and generate the exact same effects, so since its the effects you dont like, what exactly would you want to see happen in your perfect world of rpgs with levels and stats and gear.

Nobody said they wanted to remove the dLevel equation...

...if you change it so dLevel doesn't have such a large effect and make it so stats actually matter...

...well then we don't have an eye-candy (an ugly ass eye candy) window for stats that have a minimal effect on the game if they aren't VIT or MND.

[Rentahamster]

dlevel effects fights, noticeably so, but is it the only factor? is it to large a factor?

No one said it's the only factor. We've been saying it's a large factor. Too large. Waaaaay too large.

It's so overwhelmingly large that it marginalizes the hard work put into getting better gear and maximizing your stats. It decreases the value of items, which also impacts the economy.

[Reika]

Testing this on low rank monsters is an excelent way.

I am rank 50 thaumaturge. I equip a weathered scepter R1. I never put any stats into INT, so it is at base14 for me. I equip Will to power I and II, making my int 0. I equip scourge I and blizzard I:

Scourge I:
rank 1 star marmot = 2961
rank 2 star marmot = 2909
rank 3 star marmot = 2896, 2744
rank 1 Bumble beetle = 2198, 2247
rank 2 Bumble beetle = 2159, 2464, 2273, 2269
rank 3 Bumble beetle = 2016
rank 6 copper coblyn = 1095
rank 8 copper coblyn = 1024

blizzard I
rank 1 Bumble beetle = 1969
rank 1 star marmot = 2351, 3113
rank 3 star marmot = 2168

Enough of that.... have you at any time when you were rank 1 with a rank 1 weapon and minimal stats, done over 2000 damage to a monster above your rank with a single attack. No.

oh yea. Phantom dart:

R1 Bumble beetle = 831
R1 star marmot = 1318

I sure dont remember doing that much damage in my r1-10 days with my silly weathered scepter..

if your rank didnt determine at all how much damage you were going to do, i would still see less than 20 damage per hit.

If you are asking "But reika, if you equip your R43 scepter, doesnt your damage go up?"
why yes the damage does go up, but the point is, I am doing buttloads of damage to these creatures with 0 int, and a r1 weapon