The growing entitlement issues of the casuals

[solracht]

What you guys don't understand is the hardcores need things that allow them to be relatively unique from those that don't play as much. When you spend so much of your life on a video game you need something to make you feel special.

I don't really get why so many people would be upset if they came up with a few pieces of really hard to get powerful items. Sure, casuals have access to it, but it might take you 4 or 5 years to get where as it takes a hardcore 1-2 years.

You each pay for the game and there needs to be content for both forms of play styles. Just because they add some things for the hardcore doesn't mean there won't be plenty to do for casuals, or plenty of great gear that casuals have access to, it just means there are a few things you just don't play enough to really have time to get IE: A relic weapon.

Hardcores NEED things that pretty much only they will ever have (a couple/few really good rare items). Even WoW has had legendary items, does this mean casuals don't technically have access to it? No but if you've ever been in an endgame LS/guild you'd know the ones that play more will get them over the ones that don't. They put those legendary items in the game to appease the hardcore players.

It's as simple as this: Hardcores make up a good percentage of the player base and without anything to make them feel unique they WILL move onto another game.

What you don't understand is that time doesn't equal skill.

People who are better at the game than others will get things to make themselves unique. People who are both good and have more time will get more things, and faster. You're already ahead.

I understand this might be hard to see for people who only played Final Fantasy XI, a game that rewarded time commitment more than it rewarded your ability to play, but your way of thinking is both outdated and gone.

Even World of Warcraft's Legendary example that you keep on bringing up works against you: the guilds that obtained said items past the Burning Crusade did not have to spend obscene amounts of time playing: they had to play better. The raid lockouts were the same for everyone.

[Kazimir]

Even World of Warcraft's Legendary example that you keep on bringing up works against you: the guilds that obtained said items past the Burning Crusade did not have to spend obscene amounts of time playing: they had to play better. The raid lockouts were the same for everyone.

Yeah, past Burning Crusade, when the complaints about WoW increased 100 fold.

the gym analogy wouldnt work like that

lets look at how it really works

Both have access to all the equiptment, but the casuals are complaining they arent as in shape or fit, and cant lift as much as hardcores, and think that their 1 hour a week should let them bench 300 like the hardcores can.

This^

No, many of the more casual players are NOT asking for EASY, spoon-feeding content, they just don't want stupid time-wasting content like camping NMs, we don't mind working a very very small steps towards the main goal each time we play, we don't mind getting the best item much much slower(some might not even get it before that best gear becomes obsolete)

What we don't want is content which requires us to waste our precious playing time in camping, doing nothing, WAITING for pop.

Hell I don't want to sit around wasting my time camping either, but that doesn't mean there shouldn't be anything that rewards hardcores for their time playing.

Just to clarify I'm not really what I would call a hardcore player. I'm just someone who's been a hardcore player before and I know what it takes to satisfy that player base. I also know when it comes right down to it the casuals won't really care about it in the end. They certainly didn't care about not having a relic weapon in XI.

[solracht]

Yeah, past Burning Crusade, when the complaints about WoW increased 100 fold.

You mean when the quality and subscriptions of the game increased 100 fold. The fact that your dying breed was kicked off that game, just like they're going to get kicked off every MMORPG they try from now on does not mean the games are getting worse.

Either way, if you were going to bring up the way WoW's endgame worked when the cap was level 60 (like 6 years ago), don't bother. You might as well keep on mentioning HNMs to back up how a game should work. The entire raiding scene of WoW was not accessible unless you had a lot of time at level 60, just because of the nature of 40man raids.

Nice job ignoring the rest of the post too.

[Kazimir]

You mean when the quality and subscriptions of the game increased 100 fold. The fact that your dying breed was kicked off that game, just like they're going to get kicked off every MMORPG they try from now on does not mean the games are getting worse.

Either way, if you were going to bring up the way WoW's endgame worked when the cap was level 60 (like 6 years ago), don't bother. You might as well keep on mentioning HNMs to back up how a game should work. The entire raiding scene of WoW was not accessible unless you had a lot of time at level 60, just because of the nature of 40man raids.

Nice job ignoring the rest of the post too.

I read the rest of your post. "You have to play better". Then I laughed. Hi2u Hellscream's Warsong and Strength of Wrynn. Yeah, WoW is all about challenge now. *rolls eyes*

[solracht]

I read the rest of your post. "You have to play better". Then I laughed. Hi2u Hellscream's Warsong and Strength of Wrynn. Yeah, WoW is all about challenge now. *rolls eyes*

Not even going to argue about Warcraft's endgame strategies, which are about "when" you beat the content, with the window being smaller than in other MMORPGs, but I was talking about this:

What you don't understand is that time doesn't equal skill.

People who are better at the game than others will get things to make themselves unique. People who are both good and have more time will get more things, and faster. You're already ahead.

I haven't seen any of you guys ask for hard content, you're either asking for time-consuming content or content that only a linkshell can access per day. Nobody is going to cater to that if they care about their game.

You'll most likely get your hard content, however. If you're good, you'll beat it. You'll get the armor to show off for being actually good. If you're bad and can't... then maybe you didn't deserve it, even if you spent your 10 daily hours trying.

[Kazimir]

I was talking about this, but ok. I haven't seen any of you guys ask for hard content, you're either asking for time-consuming content or content that only a linkshell can access per day. Nobody is going to cater to that if they care about their game.

You'll most likely get your hard content, however. If you're good, you'll beat it. You'll get the armor to show off for being actually good. If you're bad and can't... then maybe you didn't deserve it, even if you spent your 10 daily hours trying.

I'm not actually asking for content in terms of dungeons or NM's that only hardcore players have access to. I'm advocating a reward that is so difficult to get, by the time any casual can obtain it it's obsolete. I'll use the same example I have 3 times already: Relic Weapons. Took a very long time to get. Could casuals technically get it? Yeah, it was obtained through a quest and you needed to get massive amounts of old currency to get it. Some people bought all the currency, others spammed Dynamis until they got enough currency. In the end I personally never seen a casual with it, it just took too much time. But I never heard a casual player complain about it. I never had one, I didn't really care either, it didn't ruin the game for me. But it was something that rewarded the hardcore players, and as we know they need to feel special. Anyone who plays 16 hours a day obviously has issues.

What you don't understand is that time doesn't equal skill.

People who are better at the game than others will get things to make themselves unique. People who are both good and have more time will get more things, and faster. You're already ahead.

I agree.

[TheVedis]

I'm not actually asking for content in terms of dungeons or NM's that only hardcore players have access to. I'm advocating a reward that is so difficult to get, by the time any casual can obtain it it's obsolete. I'll use the same example I have 3 times already: Relic Weapons. Took a very long time to get. Could casuals technically get it? Yeah, it was obtained through a quest and you needed to get massive amounts of old currency to get it. Some people bought all the currency, others spammed Dynamis until they got enough currency. In the end I personally never seen a casual with it, it just took too much time. But I never heard a casual player complain about it. I never had one, I didn't really care either, it didn't ruin the game for me. But it was something that rewarded the hardcore players, and as we know they need to feel special. Anyone who plays 16 hours a day obviously has issues.

Using that as an example lets face an amazing fact

Even if it was time consuming, casuals STILL had access to it, they could buy their currency if they didnt have time to grind dynamis every time it was up. The only time you were required to go into dynamis was for a few specific drops you couldnt buy.

Yes it was hard and time consuming, but based on what people in this thread are asking for, it was also accessible.

granted, the example is a bad one cuz even the hardcores cringed at trying to get that, but you get the point