RDM 7.4 changes and job identity

[Underscore]

It's crazy how backwards the developers' priorities are when it comes to encounter vs job design.

They make a Savage fight where Red Mages can't get in range to do their melee combo during one of the 2 minute windows... and their response to that little dilemma isn't to simply adjust the raid mechanic like any sensible person would, but instead to remove the 2-minute melee combo from the job itself.

What are we doing here? Why are we removing core features of the jobs and taking away their identity across the entire game for the sake of uptime during a single raid mechanic in an individual fight? Fights should be designed around the jobs, not the other way around.

[Kishin12345]

It's crazy how backwards the developers' priorities are when it comes to encounter vs job design.

They make a Savage fight where Red Mages can't get in range to do their melee combo during one of the 2 minute windows... and their response to that little dilemma isn't to simply adjust the raid mechanic like any sensible person would, but instead to remove the 2-minute melee combo from the job itself.

What are we doing here? Why are we removing core features of the jobs and taking away their identity across the entire game for the sake of uptime during a single raid mechanic in an individual fight? Fights should be designed around the jobs, not the other way around.

Well the way this game evolved over the past expansions has been that the focus lies on the fights. The difficulty comes from the encounter and not the job. So it is natural that they bend the job to the fight when that is the focus. It is probably that they design the fights and then hand it to the job balancing team and tell them to work with that.

[SyferU]

You are still going into melee range.
You are still doing no Damage because of your raise.
You are still the least flexible caster because of your melee combo.

All of red mages identity is still here.

[Underscore]

Well the way this game evolved over the past expansions has been that the focus lies on the fights. The difficulty comes from the encounter and not the job. So it is natural that they bend the job to the fight when that is the focus. It is probably that they design the fights and then hand it to the job balancing team and tell them to work with that.

Yeah, and that's wrong. This flawed, backwards thinking of theirs taken to its conclusion will result in every job being exactly the same and boring to play. We need to return to having a balance between raid and job difficulty - and jobs go beyond any one encounter, so the encounters should be designed to accommodate the jobs rather than vice versa.

[ovIm]

Yeah, and that's wrong. This flawed, backwards thinking of theirs taken to its conclusion will result in every job being exactly the same and boring to play. We need to return to having a balance between raid and job difficulty - and jobs go beyond any one encounter, so the encounters should be designed to accommodate the jobs rather than vice versa.

This thinking also makes fights feel same-y, since here, they all have to adhere to the same rhythm.
Whereas a plethora of different interesting gameplay loops in classes not only helps even with boring encounters, it also increases replayability of any encounter.

Unfortunately, CS3 are dead set on keeping the encounter over everything design paradigm as their focus. And when player numbers dwindle, the producer accounts that to players having less time instead of players maybe being bored/frustrated. Granted, if you unsubscribe, you can't exactly give the real reason why you unsubscribed, so their data is skewed there.

[Valence]

I have to agree, I was RDM for the fight in question and I hated all of it but the job shouldn't give because the fight design was atrocious. Instead the devs should playtest with all the jobs and ask "does this work?", that should have lead them to move that part of the fight to a one minute window instead of a two minute.

I'm sure they playtested it, and went "does this work?" then someone replied "not on my machine", and lo and behold the encounter design team barged in and suplexed the job design team into submission like Sabin suplexes trains.

I'm honestly really confused about why people are complaining about the changes. I personally love them.

It's a temporary range buff when you use Manafication now. You still need to dash in and do melee range combo without it. Everything else from what I've been playing has been great, and all I play is RDM. Burst window is easier, it makes me feel like an actual Magical Sword wielder when I power up and can slash away from a distance.

Why complain when your buff window was made easier? I don't get it. It's not like they removed Dual Cast or anything. Just made it easier.

I mean, you can also make a change so that you only have to spamm a single button during burst that condenses all of your abilities into one, that's making the buff window easier too. Why would people complain about it?
Heck, condense the whole rotation into a single button, job should be easier to play, who in their right mind would complain about it?

It's crazy how backwards the developers' priorities are when it comes to encounter vs job design.

They make a Savage fight where Red Mages can't get in range to do their melee combo during one of the 2 minute windows... and their response to that little dilemma isn't to simply adjust the raid mechanic like any sensible person would, but instead to remove the 2-minute melee combo from the job itself.

What are we doing here? Why are we removing core features of the jobs and taking away their identity across the entire game for the sake of uptime during a single raid mechanic in an individual fight? Fights should be designed around the jobs, not the other way around.

It's always the story and it's been going on for a long time. Remember that when P10 got released they buffed most healers and mitigation abilities to 50 yalms? And made their bubbles cover the whole screen?

[Erinellza]

I've been a RDM main for 5 and a half years and I only play normal/casual content. I'm not sure why everyone is crying about the range change. I still start my melee phase with Corps, so I still cast the melee skills in melee range. The 25y range is optional, you can just ignore it.

Also, the Prefulgence change is great, I appreciate it!

[PyurBlue]

The RDM changes are completely in line with those that hit BLM. Constraints are fun, they give you something to focus on when playing. Combat in this game is consistently going in the wrong direction.

[Basteala]

This is my fault. I went from BLM to RDM after BLM was lobotomized. Sorry guys.

I get why these changes are being made, but fight designs should be made around the jobs, not the jobs made around the fight designs.

[ForsakenRoe]

I mean, you can also make a change so that you only have to spamm a single button during burst that condenses all of your abilities into one, that's making the buff window easier too. Why would people complain about it?
Heck, condense the whole rotation into a single button, job should be easier to play, who in their right mind would complain about it?

We should do exactly that. SE did it with Healers, and it was universally accepted as 'the best video game design decision of the century' and everyone loves it /s

It's always the story and it's been going on for a long time. Remember that when P10 got released they buffed most healers and mitigation abilities to 50 yalms? And made their bubbles cover the whole screen?

30y (And 20y for GCD actions like Succor, more recently), but yes

There were times, such as M8S adds, where you had to think about what healing actions to use because you were out of range. Whether to leave the party on the other side to the cohealer, or to find an action you can use that hits both sides at once. For example, SGE couldn't hit everyone with Ixochole there, but they could hit everyone with Pneuma, or Holos, or Panhaima. It provided opportunities to be more creative in the solution for 'how to heal party', rather than just defaulting to 'press Succor/Medica'

SCH is the worst offender for this. The fact that you can move the Faerie to a different location from yourself, indirectly extending your healing range, gave SCH the potential design space for some really interesting interactions when it came to 'party is on opposite sides of the arena for this mechanic'. But now we have 20y Concitation, so whatever cool planning you came up with for those adds, is less relevant now, because you can just press Succor between each hit instead