Can we go back to using tomes to get relics?

[BlisteringFrost]

Still think they should have 2 entirely separate options; tome only variation for catch up gear, and heavily grind variation as an alternative to raid weapons.

That's already how it works....

[seolhyun]

relic should always be a grind. there are already tome weapons and crafted weapons are dirt cheap for alts.

[Celliera]

Relics can and should be a grind to obtain other than tomes.
If you just want a relatively ok weapon for tomes you always have the weekly capped tomestone weapons and in odd number patches you even get augmented crafted weapons.

Relic weapons are almost always the absolute best weapon by the end of the expac, even surpassing savage, so it should be expected that players do have to put in some modicum of effort for them.

[Valence]

Yeah, I never said the rest weren't undercooked, but I'd say a good storyline does carry a good bit of it. I didn't mind doing a lot of that work for Anima, because then I'd be rewarded by watching it get stronger, becoming able to communicate, wishing to travel with us, etc.
I'd say the key lies in allowing us to choose which kind of grindy grind we wanna do? Since in the end, this thread is a lot of "FATEs suck!" "but you're wrong, I love doing FATEs!" and so on and so forth with every type of content to ever exist. If we can at least choose between a handful of grinds, wouldn't most of us be happier?

That's what I've always said, I find that if I have to grind something that's essentially recycled content that's already in the game, then i'd rather be able to pick what I like doing. And then we go back full circle and people come at me for saying that roulettes are different when they actually aren't (by the way, tome steps are literally identical to roulette steps, the only difference is that roulette steps actually restrict the amount of eligible duties, which is arguably worse).

And currently, while it's not the most engaging, tomes are what allow the greatest pick in selection. Like it or hate it, but it's true.

[Xieldras]

Relics should be a grind, but the issue is that the grind is boring because the content is somewhat bland at the level requested. The current ones also have steps that are essentially "Repeat roulettes" and "Repeat Fates".

Personally I enjoyed the ARR relics (still working on that BLM one) because it felt like a mini-adventure for each book. You had a hit list, levequests, fates and dungeons. It made you interact with the world more.

Whilst the current grind is tedious and I do not blame others for wanting a tome weapon instead.

[Voidmage]

That's what I've always said, I find that if I have to grind something that's essentially recycled content that's already in the game, then i'd rather be able to pick what I like doing. And then we go back full circle and people come at me for saying that roulettes are different when they actually aren't (by the way, tome steps are literally identical to roulette steps, the only difference is that roulette steps actually restrict the amount of eligible duties, which is arguably worse).

And currently, while it's not the most engaging, tomes are what allow the greatest pick in selection. Like it or hate it, but it's true.

The problem with relics being tome weapons is twofold.

One is what we saw in EW. It was possible (and way to easy to do) to instantly get the relic weapons. No grinding involved, no time commitment, which was the entire purpose of relics before. They were supposed to be a time spender between patches.

The other problem is that it took content away from people like me who liked slowly working on their relic.
I understand that rng drops or long grinds are not for everyone but there are people who genuinely enjoy that type of content and it wasn't right to take it from us.

Personally I found Shb to almost be the perfect spot for relics with a big grind one time and then you were able to get the materials while doing Bozja on the side for example.
Either they go back to that or optimize what we have now in the form of tomestones as the second step TOGETHER with the option of the first step like atmas simply again.


Not directed at you because you seem to only dislike the how of the grind and not the grind itself but I think the relics never should have been changed to begin with towards those who dislike grinds.
There was a target audience and the only thing it needed was finetuning but instead in EW they completely tore it down to make a system for those who the relics where never designed for in the first place.

Nevertheless, I am optimistic. They have proven that they listen, now more than ever compared to the past and already said that the next relics might be completely different.
They seem to have been humbled and slowly get back on the right track.
But I stand by my point that the tomestone fans never should have been the ones to listen to in the first place while showing the middle finger to those who liked the grind.
The change to relics was similar to how they handled the jobs till now, ridiculous.

[Kozh]

Frankly I am sad that getting deep dungeon weapons is more fun than the relic this time. We should be doing more with field operation itself instead of whatever this step is. This step is just a glorified tome grind.

[Kozh]

That's what I've always said, I find that if I have to grind something that's essentially recycled content that's already in the game, then i'd rather be able to pick what I like doing. And then we go back full circle and people come at me for saying that roulettes are different when they actually aren't (by the way, tome steps are literally identical to roulette steps, the only difference is that roulette steps actually restrict the amount of eligible duties, which is arguably worse).

And currently, while it's not the most engaging, tomes are what allow the greatest pick in selection. Like it or hate it, but it's true.

But roulette *is* different. Sure field operation also use fate grind, but you're ignoring things that make it unique compared to content outside of it. Namely the extra system they added to it; logos, lost action, phantom jobs; tougher/deadlier enemies. For bozja we even have CLL etc. You don't get those thing when doing tomestone or grinding normal overworld fates.

Saying it's "recycled content" is also pretty unfair for me. Do you expect them to create entirely new system/mechanic for every relic grind? By your logic, it's not worth doing msq, trials, raid, deep dungeon because they're all recycled content anyway.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

Frankly I am sad that getting deep dungeon weapons is more fun than the relic this time. We should be doing more with field operation itself instead of whatever this step is. This step is just a glorified tome grind.

FWIW, I think it would be nice if they incorporate the DD as one of the possible ways to progress a relic except for the fact it rewards heliometry & we’re getting the 1.5k helios step.

[Shipp]

Can we go back to a player base that doesn't complain about everything being too hard and/or time consuming. Especially for content that is specifically designed to be time consuming to provide something to do between content droughts and in turn rewards the ultimate weapon for each job for that expansion?