Pld buff or War nerf in 1.22?

[Tetsaru]

wait, soo a well equiped DD is obviously pulling hate becuase it kicking Iffys ass, your saying you shouldnt have to invest the same amount of effort into your gear as tank to do well? It works like this, If BLM 1 can steal less hate and deal the same amount of dammage as BLM 2 then effectivly BLM 1 is doing more damage because he/she is spending less time cooling off hate or running from the mob they just pulled off the tank, or dead on the ground due to agro. The tank can do all he/she can do, but any DD can pull hate off a tank if they were well equiped and wanted to. saying you shouldnt have to invest into your gear but you want the highest dps as you can possably get is same as saying, " hey guys double and triple stack int, magic attk, enmity down , lighting potency ,ect ect and do as much damage as you can, Im just gona roll with AF gear cuz I shouldnt have to put in the same investment... see what Im getting at? if you make the engine faster better have awsome breaks too.

I never said that. I meant that having +50 enmity compared to everyone else who has LESS enmity stats than I do SHOULD mean that I have better hate control over them in general, right? However, since raw damage output and curing seem to carry more weight over +enmity gear, this is not the case. What I'm saying is, from my experience, apparently DD's wearing mostly AF gear at LV50 compared to my +enmity gear setup prevent me from holding hate when we're BOTH doing our jobs properly. I can have Flash, Provoke, Rampart, etc. constantly on cooldown through constant use, AND use my +enmity combo moves, and still not be able to keep hate over other DD's who are using their own combos/weaponskills.

So, is it MY fault that I can't keep hate, or is it the DDs' fault? And if it's the DDs' fault, then why should they always have to hold back just so that I can properly play PLD, yet they don't have to do so if I'm on WAR - just because WAR does more damage than PLD? Someone please answer that for me.

[Aion]

I never said that. I meant that having +50 enmity compared to everyone else who has LESS enmity stats than I do SHOULD mean that I have better hate control over them in general, right? However, since raw damage output and curing seem to carry more weight over +enmity gear, this is not the case. What I'm saying is, from my experience, apparently DD's wearing mostly AF gear at LV50 compared to my +enmity gear setup prevent me from holding hate when we're BOTH doing our jobs properly. I can have Flash, Provoke, Rampart, etc. constantly on cooldown through constant use, AND use my +enmity combo moves, and still not be able to keep hate over other DD's who are using their own combos/weaponskills.

So, is it MY fault that I can't keep hate, or is it the DDs' fault? And if it's the DDs' fault, then why should they always have to hold back just so that I can properly play PLD, yet they don't have to do so if I'm on WAR - just because WAR does more damage than PLD? Someone please answer that for me.

it is SE fault and they are fixing it.

[Hoshikogi]

I doubt any of the players on the forums wishes to nurf warrior to the brink of uslessness. Trust me, Ive had my fair share of class mega nurfs in other MMO (like ranger in Ever Quest II where it's damage decreased to that of a templar --> 100% pure healer). The issue isnt Warrior's damage per say, it's warriors capacity to push out massive damage while also tanking really really well. Techically, Warrior is the ultimate damage dealer with respects to their survivability. Sure, BLM can probably dish out higher overall damage, but not without greater risk.

[Rydin]

What I'm saying is, from my experience, apparently DD's wearing mostly AF gear at LV50 compared to my +enmity gear setup prevent me from holding hate when we're BOTH doing our jobs properly.

The case can be made that if a DD is preventing you from holding hate then they aren't doing their job properly

[Aceofspades]

Actually the easiest solution was for SE to not do anything, and force anyone who wants to actually TANK learn how to do so. Nothing is wrong with either job right now... and why people do not see that is beyond me. I tank on both WAR and PLD all the time, pending on what the situation is. In fights where physical damage is 80% or more of the damage delt from the boss and or fights where physical damage done to the boss is extreamly low, even for the DPS players, I go with PLD. In situations where damage taken in easly managed and war can deal moderate to high damage, I tank and WAR. personally I perfer PLD because it can survive much easier then WAR . but when its a LOL fight and its more like farming gear then a boss fight then WAR is better, simply because it makes quick work of the boss. Keep in mind the tank is only as good as its support. WAR with a realy bad dps support would be difficult to keep up on most boss fights. If your party can down a boss quick, WAR adds to that, but if its a long fight for what ever reason, PLD is the obvious choice.

[Rydin]

if its a long fight for what ever reason, PLD is the obvious choice.

Are there long fights?

[Daniel_Fury]

Can never complain with more HP, and I'm glad they have finally revised blocking for Boss status enemies!

Hmm, I hope that the revision of Goring Blade, Riot Blade and Rage of Halone will be the positioning of said skill. Since all attacks are generally used from behind, I would assume so.

Time to wait patiently.

[SwordCoheir]

Nerfing warrior was not the best solution but it was the easiest and as always that's what SE chose.

Actually the "nerf" looks more like they're just decreasing possible damage output while tanking, in favor to increasing their DD output when not-tanking which falls more in line with what Yoshi said about WAR being too strong a DD and Tank at the same time needing the adjustment. WAR will still be out-damaging PLD by a sizable margin for the same reasons it is now, because Riot Blade> Rage of Halone combo is from the backside, so PLD still would suffer from the same complications WAR would have trying to do Whirlwind or Godsblade combos when tanking and not being able to utilize it's better WS damage potential.

Not to mention WAR is easily doing 3x PLD's damage most of the time (if not more) so that's plenty of breathing room between the two jobs.

[Tetsaru]

The case can be made that if a DD is preventing you from holding hate then they aren't doing their job properly

True, but then again, I don't see the point in having a job do absolutely nothing just so you can do your own.

If the DD's are pumping out damage constantly, but the PLD can't hold hate, then essentially the DD's ARE doing their job, but the PLD ISN'T doing his job because he can't tank and hold hate. Likewise, if the PLD IS holding hate and tanking, but the DD's are having to hold back in order for the PLD to do so, then the DD's technically aren't doing their job, which is to deal high amounts of damage.

Either way, there is something wrong, and it could easily be fixed in my opinion if PLD could just generate significantly more enmity, and not have it be based purely on damage output or healing like everything else.

[Aceofspades]

I never said that. I meant that having +50 enmity compared to everyone else who has LESS enmity stats than I do SHOULD mean that I have better hate control over them in general, right? However, since raw damage output and curing seem to carry more weight over +enmity gear, this is not the case. What I'm saying is, from my experience, apparently DD's wearing mostly AF gear at LV50 compared to my +enmity gear setup prevent me from holding hate when we're BOTH doing our jobs properly. I can have Flash, Provoke, Rampart, etc. constantly on cooldown through constant use, AND use my +enmity combo moves, and still not be able to keep hate over other DD's who are using their own combos/weaponskills.

So, is it MY fault that I can't keep hate, or is it the DDs' fault? And if it's the DDs' fault, then why should they always have to hold back just so that I can properly play PLD, yet they don't have to do so if I'm on WAR - just because WAR does more damage than PLD? Someone please answer that for me.

I am sorry if I am having a hard time understanding your point of veiw simply because , and if this is a low number plz let me know, with a all blm/thm dd party the avg damage done between all 5 of the blm/thms is roughly 15-20k , I still manage to keep hate well. I think the hardest hitting blm in the group grabs Ifrit early but thats becuase she gets excited and forgets about freeze :P. All that and we get a 7 minute speed run, and I will take roughly 20-22k damage on avg now with devine veil being soo awsome. And I only had +8 enmity. I know hate controll on PLD is ok because it takes my best WAR with DPS gear on over half the fight to steal hate from me. After that he keeps hate ofcourse but that with him trying to steal hate...maybe our play styles are diffrent. not saying your wrong just different.