What to manage as a tank?

[Ayan_Calvesse]

I think tanks try to reduce party wide damage as their prime function and act as the "point of the spear" for engagement. I don't really find threat management a big thing except when we talk tank swaps really. I use the words reduce party damage given that all tanks have 2 items in their kit to reduce damage on party members; one of which is generally on a 30second or less CD. A Tank contributes in other ways (DPS for example) but really thats the nuts and bolts of it.

Tank busters pretty much exist to prevent folks from making DPS rush parties for current content.

[zarahleo]

If dps has to manage rotation
And healer has to manage party health

What to manage as a tank?

Tanks have general management, they manage a bit of everything. DPS rotation, mitigation for themselves and party members, placement of mobs/bosses and the pace of a duty, some aggro management for some mechanics and ensuring u aggro every enemy in a mob. Without this general management the duty falls apart pretty quickly or becomes much more intensive for the other players.

[CaedemSanguis]

DSR p7 is an example of how far aggro management can go
They also have CD management, usually in week1 you have to be very careful and map you’re fight
They also have a rotation, a bit easier than dps but still
TBN/HoC/Cover can be used to save someone during prog
Tank LB can also save a pull
M1s you need to place the boss for uptime
Theres also a lot of bosses with cleavs

I did ucob in both melee dps and tank, I find it harder in tank (and im a main tank)

So yeah, I definitely dont see the point of topic, but OP is most likely just trolling

[Stigs]

There was a time where, when I tanked, my eyes would be darting between my hotbars, my HP bar, the enmity bars on the party list, my buff/debuff list, my positioning, and debuffs/dots on the boss.

Now it's just my hp bar, job gauge, and hotbars. I feel like a discount dps. Buffs that you have to keep up still exist, but they're so lenient you barely have to pay attention. Sometimes in some savage fights you have to do tank swaps (that have almost always worked the same way since Stormblood), and sometimes you can do some positioning to give melee more uptime.

Go back and watch a video of T4/T6/T7/T10/T12/T13 when it was new, or A2S/A3S/A5S/A7S/A10S and just look at how much positioning tanks used to have to do. Even current positioning almost never compares(shoutout to e2s for being a positioning heavy modern fight), because it actually mattered what direction the boss/adds were facing back then. If a phase had a ton of healing tanks would have to prep GCD's that generated a lot of aggro so enemies didn't go one shot the healer with an auto attack. Yeah, your rotation was a bit more simple overall, but you were doing actual tank stuff constantly. You had responsibility.

[Nero-Voidstails]

you obviously never played a tank if you believe aggro management is not a thing.... tank stance alone is not enough to keep aggro given some dps have insane damage output. i've lost aggro on enemies many times due to people focussing damage during a pull.
mitigations are a must or you will wipe if your healer is not up to the task to become a healerbot to keep your sorry ass alive. (wich at that point if you dont use mitigations why even bother playing a tank class? just go dps and pull enemies as dps. pretty much the same thing)

and lastly.
tanks should manage: Boss and pull position. cluttered up pulls are better to hit then spread out when we speak targeted AoE's.
face bosses away from your party in regards to cleave or cone attacks.
mitigation rotation. spamming all mits in 1 go get you wiped on your next pull. mitigation not at all gets you most likely wiped instantly as many healers will not and cannot deal the sheer damage if NOT mitigated. (i speak of experience)
and YES enmity management. ALWAYS make sure you are A on the enmity list. some dps focus damage on targets during a pull and will take enmity away from you (bahamut and phoenix even have increased enmity as an effect)
and some dps have such high single target dps they generate enmity while you run forward as tank. KEEP sheild lobbing or unmending. use a provoke or since 7.05 use AoE's and gap closer abilties for increased enmity on the targets.

IF YOU FAIL 1 OF THESE, YOU'RE A MEDIOCRE TANK
IF YOU FAIL MULTIPLE OF THESE YOU'RE A BAD TANK

between pulls like running to one pack to a other always use the aoe Dot's if you are a pal or a gunbreaker

[BabyYoda]

Tanking never been easy.. like wtf ? why no one noticed that tanks manage so little.. the simplest rotation.. OP mitigations (except you dark knight).. healing is more optimal than healers..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xINq...l=SlienceRiver
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k65b...l=SlienceRiver

I wonder why we don't have clear without a tank.. maybe but maybe the role is overtune and can do 2 role in 1 job.

[CKNovel]

You're the other account of Tunda, correct?

I encourage you to look beyond the title of the videos and to understand what's going on.
I'll even give you a hint with the timestamp:

Look at what is happening and what players are doing to dodge a healer mechanic.
Ironically, this clear was done because every player, especially tanks, overmanaged their responsibility.

On top of that, those clears have been done by that singular group and they already did "No healer all summoners" before tank sustain got a buff, which proves tank sustain wasn't the culprit.

[Supersnow845]

You're the other account of Tunda, correct?

I encourage you to look beyond the title of the videos and to understand what's going on.
I'll even give you a hint with the timestamp:

Look at what is happening and what players are doing to dodge a healer mechanic.
Ironically, this clear was done because every player, especially tanks, overmanaged their responsibility.

On top of that, those clears have been done by that singular group and they already did "No healer all summoners" before tank sustain got a buff, which proves tank sustain wasn't the culprit.

Why are healers only “needed” in a fight because of a single mechanic (THEY COULDNT EVEN CODE RIGHT ILL ADD) that’s meant to be a healer check rather than actually making a healer necessary across the entire fight

I can’t imagine tanks would be happy if the boss ignored them for 15 minutes then did one mechanic that amounted to a tank check then went back to ignoring them for another 5 minutes

It’s an ultimate, if you don’t have a healer you should be wiping within 20 seconds without a healer

(Note I’m not trying to argue with you on past grievances, this is actually a “why should this be considered acceptable” question)

[CKNovel]

“why should this be considered acceptable”

It's actually very easy to answer.
Mario 64 was completed without jumping, yet it doesn't mean jumping is useless. I can safely say that 99.9% of the players will use the jump.
The same way, you can go from west coast to east coast of US with a bike instead of a car. Does it means cars are useless and it's unnacceptable?
Pokemon yellow can be completed under 2 minutes. Does that mean the game is too short and the state is unacceptable?
No, it's just possible and that's what those people wanted to prove.

99.9% of the groups have healers because it's much more comfortable than rely on a tank, even if healerless run are possible.
You're looking too much into it, it's just a dumb challenge. If you just remove Clemency, a healer GCD, those challenges suddenly becomes impossible.

Wether Clemency should be removed or not is another debate.
You could do it and 99.9% of the game would remain fine but at the same time you'd be killing job identity because those 0.1% challenge are possible.

[Supersnow845]

It's actually very easy to answer.
Mario 64 was completed without jumping, yet it doesn't mean jumping is useless. I can safely say that 99.9% of the players will use the jump.
The same way, you can go from west coast to east coast of US with a bike instead of a car. Does it means cars are useless and it's unnacceptable?
Pokemon yellow can be completed under 2 minutes. Does that mean the game is too short and the state is unacceptable?
No, it's just possible and that's what those people wanted to prove.

99.9% of the groups have healers because it's much more comfortable than rely on a tank, even if healerless run are possible.
You're looking too much into it, it's just a dumb challenge. If you just remove Clemency, a healer GCD, those challenges suddenly becomes impossible.

Wether Clemency should be removed or not is another debate.
You could do it and 99.9% of the game would remain fine but at the same time you'd be killing job identity because those 0.1% challenge are possible.

Okay then next question. Do you think it feels good that your job is a “convenience” and not a need? Because to me it doesn’t. The fact that every time we get a new fight someone is able to do this shows there is a problem they won’t address. I want to be tested to the limits of my kit, not be tested on my 1 GCD spam uptime

If there is no tank the boss wallops the party in 20 seconds, if there is no DPS then the boss enrages 2 minutes in if not earlier to an add mechanic like dolls.

Being the role in a hard trinity that amounts to “you are only there because people aren’t good enough to get rid of you” doesn’t feel good when you want to feel powerful and feel like you meaningfully contributed to the party which is a big difference to comparing biking and driving across America because if you are good enough to dump the healer then your performance actually improves as shown with the M4 clear

AND ITS SO EASY TO FIX, just double the amount of raidwides or have bleeds that apply that can’t be mitigated and last a long time

Being a role of convenience (and in casual content it’s more being an enforced burden in DF) doesn’t feel good