Stormblood Scholar could be back in 8.0

[Sylvain]

I literally reduce DPS buttons for scholar from 3 to 1 how did my idea is DPS focused?
Do you actually read?

Yes, but at the same time you put "consumes x poison" on each ability.
Unless you can cast without poison? But then what's the point, for the small healing bonus?

- If you need the poison stacks to heal, because they need to be consummed (which is usually implied for a "consuming" ability), then yes, your version is more DPS centric because even if SCH had 10 dps key, they could still heal while pressing 0 dps key.
In your case, you cannot heal without using dps key even if there's only 1. (two actually because you added one which double poisons stacks, in case you forgot)
- If you do not need the poisons stack, then you're still more dps centric because if you want the healing bonus you need to dps to keep the 3 stacks of poison which only last 6s or 9 stack to summon Seraph. Whereas again, even if SCH had 10 keys, a SCH wishing to only heal would be able to do 100% of their healing potential by not pressing any.

Either way, your version is more dps centric because unlike current sch, your design makes DPS affect healing positively. A SCH not dps-ing will have less healing potential than one doing. Even if there's only 1 dps spell and 1 ability (double poison stacks)

How is this unclear?

Your own design, how is this unclear?

DPS neutral is fine, but something that promotes overhealing for damage procs or promotes not healing for damage is bad design.

I would agree but this cannot be avoided unless you increase damage to the point where "at BiS with perfectily synced teamplay and mitigation your toolkit (so amount of available lilies) are at best barely enough to heal without throwing a single gcd heal that is not a lilly."
Which would make all fight exactly at the same healing requirement and horribly hard to heal at an entry level of gear.
Let's take black cat, there are two moments where the healing is a bit tight where you usually place your bell, when you have the proxy bait + wind share. In between it can be fairely easily healed with only lilies.
Imagine how many more raid burst that boss would need to do so that at an ilv 730, with good team mate and mitigation, you have 0 spare lily to just throw to build your blood lilly. That'd be so insanely high that no casual healer moderately skill would be able to heal through that fight at min ilv on week1.
By virtue of getting gear, we heal more and take less damage. At some point, your "i need 2 lilies here" become "i need 1 lilly here" and well... you still have that lilly...
However, one thing they should do IMO is to remove magic resist on gear and normalise magical damage taken. Because getting gear has a multiplicative effect on the healing requirement. (more healing, less damage taken) hence why healing becomes so easy (and thus bring the issue you're having with overhealing).

In case your problem is just from specifically using healing ressource like lilies to get damage, it's still tied to the above... if you weren't using a lilly you'd be using a glare... in the end the issue is that the healing requirement falls down waaayyy too fast with stuff.

For SCH I completely disagree because ED is not superior to the healing tools you can use with aether, EDs strength is that it slowly adds up in damage but its not significant enough to effect the DPS output of SCH completely, if you don't ED once in a fight you'll still do enough damage for the healers damage check easily it just allows you to get uses out of your aethercharges if you don't need them until the next cycle

Maybe I wasn't clear enough but that's what I meant. When using one of your 4 skill tied to AF, the healing vastly out perform the gain from ED as indeed, it is not significant enough (thanks god). Even if you'd use all your AF as ED, that's only 400 potency per minute (adding dissipation) which is 1.3 extra broil per minute... sure over 10 minutes that's a whooping 30s-ish worth of dps but surely if you can affort that, dps check was really not an issue.

And I agree Assize on the other hand has to be used for damage and not (or barely) delayed. At least Earthly Star has a 20s window so the odds of using it for both healing and damage are better than assize. (and it's so massive it also works if the group is far appart)

[Tunda]

Yes, but at the same time you put "consumes x poison" on each ability.
Unless you can cast without poison? But then what's the point, for the small healing bonus?

- If you need the poison stacks to heal, because they need to be consummed (which is usually implied for a "consuming" ability), then yes, your version is more DPS centric because even if SCH had 10 dps key, they could still heal while pressing 0 dps key.
In your case, you cannot heal without using dps key even if there's only 1. (two actually because you added one which double poisons stacks, in case you forgot)
- If you do not need the poisons stack, then you're still more dps centric because if you want the healing bonus you need to dps to keep the 3 stacks of poison which only last 6s or 9 stack to summon Seraph. Whereas again, even if SCH had 10 keys, a SCH wishing to only heal would be able to do 100% of their healing potential by not pressing any.

Either way, your version is more dps centric because unlike current sch, your design makes DPS affect healing positively. A SCH not dps-ing will have less healing potential than one doing. Even if there's only 1 dps spell and 1 ability (double poison stacks)

I didn't bring this up this is already in the current design..aetherflow system for scholar which you consume aether to do healing or doing damage.. this is already in the design since ShB..

there is no double poison on my rework.. it double the stacks that give you passives or allow to activate other spells there is no DPS gain..

"- If you need the poison stacks to heal, because they need to be consummed (which is usually implied for a "consuming" ability), then yes, your version is more DPS centric because even if SCH had 10 dps key, they could still heal while pressing 0 dps key."

in fact this actually inforce healers to play the game as intended as developers says "healers must DPS" this is the current design even if you don't like it there is no contradictions..
BTW I mentioned that scholar can do healing without stacks but it will cost more MP and cast time.

"- If you do not need the poisons stack, then you're still more dps centric because if you want the healing bonus you need to dps to keep the 3 stacks of poison which only last 6s or 9 stack to summon Seraph. Whereas again, even if SCH had 10 keys, a SCH wishing to only heal would be able to do 100% of their healing potential by not pressing any."

and again this will in force players to play healers as developer intended to design the role.
you really don't understand how healers been designed in this game.

"Either way, your version is more dps centric because unlike current sch, your design makes DPS affect healing positively. A SCH not dps-ing will have less healing potential than one doing. Even if there's only 1 dps spell and 1 ability (double poison stacks)"

the current design let you choose between DPSing or Healing.. this is bad design for people who will 100% greed and choose dps.. you will see these people in the high-end
my idea is to actually in force healers to do what they suppose to do damage(which how developers intend healer to do) and healing with no point that you will choose DPS over healing.

double stack is a utility spell not a dps gain.

best scholars in the game do DPS because they understand how healers meant to play..

at this point I really don't know weather you troll or you just don't understand FFXIV healer design.

[Sylvain]

I didn't bring this up this is already in the current design..aetherflow system for scholar which you consume aether to do healing or doing damage.. this is already in the design since ShB..

This is not the same.
The current design is OR, your design is TO

You need AF to heal OR to dps
You need poison stack TO heal

in fact this actually inforce healers to play the game as intended as developers says "healers must DPS" this is the current design even if you don't like it there is no contradictions..

Dude how can you be so hypocritical.
You complain that current SCH focuses too much on DPS, you want to reduce the amount of DPS skill and want healer to be able to 100% focus on healing.
You propose something that does litterally the opposite, I point it and you then say "well this design goes along what the dev want, us to dps, so I don't see the problem".

"the reason that we can't have healer without DPS spells is the game design.. I wish we can have it but we can't bro.. the game designed in a way that healer must do DPS.
and how to make Healer DPS interesting? to make it part of their kit."
Your words.
You wish for healer without DPS, to not have to choose

my idea is to actually in force healers to do what they suppose to do damage(which how developers intend healer to do) and healing with no point that you will choose DPS over healing.
What does the poison stack do? According to your tooltip, a DoT damage.
What does a healing spell/ability do? Heal + consumming a poison stack.
Do you do more damage with 5 poison stack than 4 poison stack?
yes : then you're back to the current system, damage or healing. You chose to heal at the expense of 1 poison stack until re-applied
no : Then what are the stack for? Just remove ED at this point and you reach your end game and SCH stops needing to dps OR heal.

.

double stack is a utility spell not a dps gain

Boss has 5 stack, receives x damage over the next server tick.
two scenarios unfold
use "double stack" : boss goes up to 10 stack, receives 2x damage.
do not use "double stack" : boss stays at 5 stack and thus receive x damage at the next server tick.
2x > x, therefor more damage (a dps gain)

Like for real? Doubling a DoT stack is not a dps upgrade? (unless you're idea is of a stackable poison dealing no damage)

at this point I really don't know weather you troll or you just don't understand FFXIV healer design.

Men you sure seems confident about your understanding and experience in the game, really curious about your achievement to speak with such a condescendant tone.

[Tunda]

This is not the same.
The current design is OR, your design is TO

You need AF to heal OR to dps
You need poison stack TO heal

"You need AF to heal OR to dps"
is a bad design.. people will consume it to do damage.. did you actually play high-end content? even extreme? did you play with scholar? do you understand human nature of greed?
there is no healer in the game currently other than scholar who they has to choose between healing or dpsing and there is a reason behind it because it is a bad design.

WHM and SGE their DPS kit go along with their healing kit and they are not perfect but they solve the issue of letting people to choose between 2 contractional options.

This is not the same.
Dude how can you be so hypocritical.
You complain that current SCH focuses too much on DPS, you want to reduce the amount of DPS skill and want healer to be able to 100% focus on healing.
You propose something that does litterally the opposite, I point it and you then say "well this design goes along what the dev want, us to dps, so I don't see the problem".

I complain about how homonogized the healers are and how their DPS kit is not related to Healing kit.. which seperate 2 kits and homonogized 4 jobs with the same DPS kit.

current design give you options which can turn bad if you choose either one.

My idea to reduce the focus on having too much dps spells to 1.. current scholar is DPS focus you have to make dot 100% uptime and you have to broil each 2.5 second, and you have to click debuff each 120 second and another dot each 120 second.. 4 things you have to manage and 2 of them you have to keep them uptime.. this will make healers focus more on dps than actual healing.. but again you can't get it.

you can't create healer with no dps buttons!! and you can't create unique kit without making them part of their kit.. repeat it 3 time each day.


""the reason that we can't have healer without DPS spells is the game design.. I wish we can have it but we can't bro.. the game designed in a way that healer must do DPS.
and how to make Healer DPS interesting? to make it part of their kit."
Your words.
You wish for healer without DPS, to not have to choose"

lol are you understanding what I have been saying?
if you have 0 dps buttons how you will finish the story? how will you kill mobs? I guess there questions are harder that what you expect.

Having dps buttons for healers is part of healer design philosophy that the game decide to be no me bro.. not me.. if you disagree call yoshi p he will answer you 100%.

"What does the poison stack do? According to your tooltip, a DoT damage.
What does a healing spell/ability do? Heal + consumming a poison stack.
Do you do more damage with 5 poison stack than 4 poison stack?
yes : then you're back to the current system, damage or healing. You chose to heal at the expense of 1 poison stack until re-applied
no : Then what are the stack for? Just remove ED at this point and you reach your end game and SCH stops needing to dps OR heal.
"
regarding DPS of stacks:
having 1 stack = having 5 stack
there is no DPS gain unless you go beyond 6 stacks which will increase damage of dot 20%.. to in force the game philosophy that you do not agree with.. or you don't like it don't play healers.
making things passives is better than button will consume 2.5 second of your time you could rather use another spell.

based on question the answer is NO.
stacks is similar to job gauge for any job you have pool of 10 balls you can consume balls to do spells.. dps kit is part of healing kit to make them unique again I am repeating myself for 3 posts.

"Men you sure seems confident about your understanding and experience in the game, really curious about your achievement to speak with such a condescendant tone."

I am really confident of what I do.. that's why I challenged your argument and you still do not answer it.. it seems that you can't have an answer yet.

people do not need achievement to understand basics of current healer design.. they just have to get it that's it.
you want healer with no dps then how they can do story?
then how do they fit in the current design?

many questions you can't answer it and you still think that you are right! interesting