Advice on How to Give Advice

[KLuz]

Hello! So the title basically gets at the question that I have - "how would you or people prefer to receive advice?" (Consider this your TLDR)

Background: This question stems from two converging trends I've been noticing -

(1) The general commentary that Dawntrail has "upped the ante" on difficulty of content in the game, and

(2) the longstanding stigma around wanting to be a helpful person in the game and being met with (often hostile) opposition in response.

In the last 2 weeks, it has felt like an increasingly frequent occurrence for me (definitely some bias as a result). I definitely don't think I'm the best player in the world, and I put a bit more weight on trying to be a good mentor than I probably should given the perceptions of mentors in the game. In the more recent occurrences, I have offered advice to gamers and the response has been... challenging, to say the least. Despite the level of animosity I've been met with, I've tried to remain polite (though I'm human and am susceptible to the whims of pettiness from time to time). Because I'm interested in reflecting and because my intent really is to just be helpful, I'm offering this as a long shot to try to get some advice on how to offer advice. It can come from anyone such as people who are struggling with the difficulty of the content or folks who have been able to successfully give advice without the backlash. I'm sure some will suggest that I don't offer the advice at all and just nope out of the situations; I'm equally interested in understanding more about that approach too. It is definitely something I am considering as an option too, though I lament that it won't help out people who could use a hand and would be responsive/thankful. Thanks in advance

[Andevom]

Give advice when asked for advice and you can't go wrong. Otherwise, don't.

[KLuz]

Give advice when asked for advice and you can't go wrong. Otherwise, don't.

So I should resign to failing the duty then? What happens when advice isn't solicited though it should be?

[Shikiseki]

I honestly can only advice you to be more selective with who's worth your time mentoring in this game because quite frankly, many people (as you noticed yourself) just respond badly about it. Save your effort, even if it's with good-intent, because at the end of the day they just simply do not care and so should you. It will keep your mind healthy too, knowing those who do appreciate it will improve.

That doesn't mean to stop being helpful of course, it just requires a certain sense (?) to know when that person is actually wanting to improve but needs a lil nudge into the right direction which you'll get as you do more duties.
They will most likely apologize in chat and that's usually your queue to give them a small(!) hint as to why they kept dying. Noone wants a 10min guide on what to do in a normal duty

Does that make me a bad mentor? Maybe. But I'm more than happy to assist any person that is willing to listen and that's all I care about after 10/11years

[KLuz]

I honestly can only advice you to be more selective with who's worth your time mentoring in this game because quite frankly, many people (as you noticed yourself) just respond badly about it. Save your effort, even if it's with good-intent, because at the end of the day they just simply do not care and so should you. It will keep your mind healthy too, knowing those who do appreciate it will improve.

That doesn't mean to stop being helpful of course, it just requires a certain sense (?) to know when that person is actually wanting to improve but needs a lil nudge into the right direction which you'll get as you do more duties.
They will most likely apologize in chat and that's usually your queue to give them a small(!) hint as to why they kept dying. Noone wants a 10min guide on what to do in a normal duty

Does that make me a bad mentor? Maybe. But I'm more than happy to assist any person that is willing to listen and that's all I care about after 10/11years

Nah I think that makes a lot of sense. Reflecting back, I've definitely had some positive interactions when things have gone that way.

[Maxilor]

IMO it really depends on how badly you are failing a duty.

I use a simple checklist:

1. Are you completing the content fine, but you notice someone is playing in an odd or incorrect way? Don't give advice unless asked.

2. Did someone die, or the group wiped but the player that erred has an excuse out of their control? (example: cat attacked them) No, I still wouldn't give advice unless asked.

3. Did it happen again? Yes, I would start giving pointers in a friendly way. (example: Perhaps you can put your cat in a cage to prevent the maulings?)

4. Do they refuse to fix the issue and you continue to fail? Votekick.

Player POV:

[KLuz]

IMO it really depends on how badly you are failing a duty.

I use a simple checklist:

1. Are you completing the content fine, but you notice someone is playing in an odd or incorrect way? Don't give advice unless asked.

2. Did someone die, or the group wiped but the player that erred has an excuse out of their control? (example: cat attacked them) No, I still wouldn't give advice unless asked.

3. Did it happen again? Yes, I would start giving pointers in a friendly way. (example: Perhaps you can put your cat in a cage to prevent the maulings?)

4. Do they refuse to fix the issue and you continue to fail? Votekick.

Player POV:

This gave me a good chuckle! How would you define "completing the content fine?"

[AmiableApkallu]

My general rules of thumb:

1. Be yourself. Speak the way you normally would.

2. If someone asks for advice, then offer it. Answer the question. But don't take the opportunity to unload everything else that's on your mind.

3. If no one asks, then wait for the end of combat. If it's a wipe, ask whether anyone has questions, or phrase your suggestion for preventing the wipe as a question ("Maybe we should...?"). But if it's the first wipe and no one speaks up, maybe just give it another go. Sometimes people learn; sometimes they'll get more frustrated and become more open to advice.

4. Try to phrase things in a way that makes it clear everyone has a part to play. For example, not, "Healer, take the stack marker mid." Instead, "That might be easier if we all stacked in the center."

[Maxilor]

This gave me a good chuckle! How would you define "completing the content fine?"

lol glad you liked it.

I'd say as long as the dungeon/trial is being completed in a somewhat normal pace then everything is fine. Some people are nervous about wall to wall pulling and will do half pulls and I don't see an issue with that for example.

However, if you were single pulling I might suggest as a Healer to speed things up a bit lol.

[mallleable]

I have found that stating what I do to handle a situation is more effective than stating what someone else should do in the same situation. Like 'I like to use Arm's Length here' vs. 'You should use Arm's Length here.' And a little empathy goes a looong way like agreeing that a mechanic can be a little tricky even if it isn't for you personally.