Advice on How to Give Advice

[KLuz]

IMO it really depends on how badly you are failing a duty.

I use a simple checklist:

1. Are you completing the content fine, but you notice someone is playing in an odd or incorrect way? Don't give advice unless asked.

2. Did someone die, or the group wiped but the player that erred has an excuse out of their control? (example: cat attacked them) No, I still wouldn't give advice unless asked.

3. Did it happen again? Yes, I would start giving pointers in a friendly way. (example: Perhaps you can put your cat in a cage to prevent the maulings?)

4. Do they refuse to fix the issue and you continue to fail? Votekick.

Player POV:

This gave me a good chuckle! How would you define "completing the content fine?"

[Maxilor]

This gave me a good chuckle! How would you define "completing the content fine?"

lol glad you liked it.

I'd say as long as the dungeon/trial is being completed in a somewhat normal pace then everything is fine. Some people are nervous about wall to wall pulling and will do half pulls and I don't see an issue with that for example.

However, if you were single pulling I might suggest as a Healer to speed things up a bit lol.

[AmiableApkallu]

My general rules of thumb:

1. Be yourself. Speak the way you normally would.

2. If someone asks for advice, then offer it. Answer the question. But don't take the opportunity to unload everything else that's on your mind.

3. If no one asks, then wait for the end of combat. If it's a wipe, ask whether anyone has questions, or phrase your suggestion for preventing the wipe as a question ("Maybe we should...?"). But if it's the first wipe and no one speaks up, maybe just give it another go. Sometimes people learn; sometimes they'll get more frustrated and become more open to advice.

4. Try to phrase things in a way that makes it clear everyone has a part to play. For example, not, "Healer, take the stack marker mid." Instead, "That might be easier if we all stacked in the center."

[mallleable]

I have found that stating what I do to handle a situation is more effective than stating what someone else should do in the same situation. Like 'I like to use Arm's Length here' vs. 'You should use Arm's Length here.' And a little empathy goes a looong way like agreeing that a mechanic can be a little tricky even if it isn't for you personally.

[Astrus]

Unsolicited advice tends to go over badly in a lot of cases, especially if there was nothing that prompted it.
I loathe the people that launch into a detailed explanation the moment the party draws close to a boss arena (they have these macro'd I suppose?) not even giving the party the chance to try this blind. This is especially aggravating on new encounters that aren't even special as far as mechanics go.

If it's not Ex or Savage give people a chance to fail and learn from it.
If anyone asks for advice by all means provide it. If the group isn't learning, nobody asks for advice and you notice a problem offer to give some.
If nobody takes you up on it you need to make a choice (I usually just work my way down this list):

• let the group try and risk failure again, continue to offer to give advice
• if the issue is moving out of mechanics and you know the dance throw a marker on yourself
• give unsolicited advice pertaining to that specific problem, risk getting yelled at and your advice ignored. When giving advice in this way phrase it as a suggestion, not an order or simply say "[this mechanic] does [thing]" without calling anyone out.
• votekick the problematic player if it's just one
• leave if you think the party as a whole isn't worth your time

There is no elegant right solution to this problem, just varying degrees of stepping on people's toes or letting them step on yours. There is no universally right way of giving advice, it all depends on the situation and the people involved. There is, however, a wrong way to give advice (unsolicited, unprompted and commanding) and it's best to avoid that.

[Mackerris]

Ask, don't tell.
Ask if they want some help, as you have ideas, knowledge, etc. Then show them the way. Guide them. Telling is often construed as dictating, and creates negativity. Of course some will be offended no matter what you do.

[Akonyl]

In a dungeon/normal raid situation, I basically just give advice if we wipe twice to the same thing, or we wipe once and someone failed the same mechanic multiple times (causing the wipe). But I'll definitely sass people who spoil mechs before anyone even sees them.

[TheOperator3712]

Don't. This community has a portion of it that is completely repulsed by the notion that they could be doing anything wrong and will freak out if you give them any advice whatsoever. It's not worth risking your account to try to help these people. If they're preventing duty completion, just vote kick and move on.

[CamuiKushi]

I always just say "You want some advice?" if someone seems to be struggling. If they don't reply I don't say anything further... unless we start wiping. Then it's unsolicited advice time. If they get annoyed/toxic that's on them. No point being petty cause they're clearly having a bad enough time already.

[SamSmoot]

Long ago, one player kept dying to an easily avoidable dungeon mechanic: "If you get the beam on you, run to one of the poles around the perimeter to get rid if it before it kills you." Rather than call the player out, I just typed the above quoted line. He didn't fail it again.