Feedback: Dawntrail MSQ dungeon difficulty

[Alakazamtrainer]

As someone who plays the extrememly casual, i disagree whole heartedly! I found the dungeons of DT far more enganging (save that turtle) then previous expansions. So please, and i mean please, dont ruin this for others who are finding this enjoyable, its level 100, nothing we saw wasnt seen before, its just a different indicator.

[EiraWoqiso]

I understand those with medical issues making these dungeons significantly more difficult than intended, but genuinely if you're playing in a party - NOT trusts - then these dungeons are fine. If you're tanking they might be more difficult since you going down quickly leads to others going down, but that aside you can easily be carried through these dungeons. Yes, even Strayborough.

imo, these dungeons are the perfect difficulty. Difficult enough that you actually have to pay attention, you might wipe a couple times, and you actually need to use your kit. Old dungeons are... mindless. You can go through most dungeons in the game giving 60% of your attention to a Youtube video on the side and 40% to the game. The content being a little difficult finally made the lower-than-extremes battle content fun for the first time since, like... original Thunder God?

[Blacksuit00]

Oh, it would be absolutely and overwhelmingly stacked against OP. But I firmly believe these forums don't represent the views of the community as a whole, no forum populace ever does.

You’re absolutely right. The people who come on here to complain about how “ hard “ shit is are a very minuscule but vociferous minority of people. For 10 or so years y’all had shit easy, the content was given to y’all on a golden platter with how easy it was and now that square slightly made the dungeons more engaging and fun 10 years of this braindead content being out y’all still have learned absolutely nothing?, that’s insanely pathetic. These dungeons aren’t even harder, but for some reason y’all find can’t find 2 neurons to rub together to do content that y’all have done for years but at a braindead slow pace.

And the thing that annoys me about y’all is that y’all are the people, which some of the people in here whining and complaining admitted to, that will do this content 2 to 3 times max to get through the story content and then fuck off, what about us who want engagement that are gonna do this content religiously?, that’s absolutely selfish. Learn the damn content instead of asking for shit to be given to you because yall are to lazy and reluctant to learn anything.

[Blacksuit00]

Good question. In fact, the other thread has basically become 40 pages (at the time of this post) of players commenting "get good", "skill issue" and variations thereof. And many of them are just outright overly aggressive and/or insulting - which is, in my opinion, completely unnecessary and unwarranted.

No it is not unnecessary and it is definitely warranted because you will get on here and call for the enactment of change that the vast majority of the player base don’t want just because 3 to 4 of you struggled and died in a dungeon. Look up a guide, google what you don’t know or are unsure of, and then get up and go again. Y’all had 10 FULL YEARS to learn the fundamentals of the game, the basic bottom of the barrel fundamentals and you still refuse to learn and adapt and develop your skills and grow, that or you’re just lazy af cause these dungeons are not hard in the slightest, yall are just indolent or stupid, pick one.

People are tired of y’all ruining the game for everyone else to dumb down the mechanics to the point where you could sever your optic nerve, get a lobotomy, come in rub the back of your hands across the keyboard like you’re having a stroke and still clear content.

We ( the vast majority of people) don’t want that, we want something engaging and square is finally giving us that and here y’all come pissing and shitting up the place to ruin everyone else’s fun cause y’all died a few times in a dungeon and wanna throw a tantrum. Learn the content instead of expecting everything to be given to you by making the content so easy that a newborn baby born without arms could clear the content.

[lolnah]

OP, I mean this with no malice whatsoever but you really should play more games if you think the DT dungeons are anywhere near Soulsborne difficulty.

[Zerovii]

Agree 100%.

If any of the people complaining about the difficulty had been in one of my groups, we would have gotten them through it, encouraged and helped them with the parts they were struggling with, and had a great time doing it.

I understand the anxiety of going into multiplayer and worrying about being a drag on the group. I feel it too when I go into harder content even when I know I'm capable.

That said, I can count on one hand the number of unkind words I've seen said to anyone in this game over the years, even in Extreme and Savage Party Finder groups with people who are struggling hard. Overwhelmingly, people in DF and even PF are welcoming, helpful and encouraging. Especially if you tell them it's your first time or you have a hard time with certain mechanics or whatever else.

To reaffirm this post, I always go RDM in roulettes just to help people who are struggling and carry them over the finish line with no judgement. I'm actually happy when they mess up because it's not just me doing my usual rotation for the 100,000x time and actually thinking about mp management

[celfhelp]

"Use Trusts" "Get Good" "You don't need to do this content lol."

You know what kind of players will dominate this game if this trend continues. I have seen many a game experiencing this.

It is simple: more grinding and unforgiving mechanism -> competitiveness and toxicity prevail; less grinding and unforgiving mechanism -> collaboration and friendship grow.

Yoshi-p has a choice, so do we all.

To those who mock casual players who have better things to tend to in real life: What are you afraid of?

The falsehood of the sense of superiority? From a Small Small dungeon? Your refusal to understand the Main Story?

You are entitled to enjoy the game your way, but not entitled to talk about other players in such a mean fashion.

Get good in your etiquette, please. How other players play the game is none of your business.

this is a smidge hypocritical and manipulative, and frankly, this smells more like a superiority complex than any of the "get good" responses do

if you are trying to convince devs to stop innovating and progressing, or if you're dying endlessly to the same mechanics over and over because you can't be bothered to get yourself together, then how you play the game becomes everybody's business because you are the one being "toxic"

sure, people could be a bit nicer about it, but no one is required to be nice about anything. the real world is decidedly not nice an overwhelming majority of the time, and no online space is required to be a little insulated pocket of fantasy

if you're not good enough at your job, you lose your job. if you get in an accident because you're bad at driving, you have to pay for repairs. if your house explodes because you left the stove on, you don't have a house anymore. if you don't rest when you're sick, you delay your recovery

alternatively, do you know what makes communities everywhere grow stronger? adversity. what brings humans together unlike anything else? struggle

this has a double meaning here because:

1. sometimes people aren't nice and that's a good thing, because end of the day, conflict breeds collaboration and abrasion breeds resilience and strength

2. harder challenges to overcome breeds more communication and collaboration surrounding how to overcome the challenge

both of these are objectively good and constructive things, and "toxic" people only take over a community if the "non-toxic" people leave

if you're that worried about "toxic" people, find ways to overcome them; don't waste yourself becoming just like them via moral grandstanding and putting yourself and your views on a pedestal



the online realm and especially modern online gaming has coddled people a little bit (a lotta bit) too much, but it's scenarios like this one that help spark growth out of that stunted, naive space. you have to find the value in it because it's definitely there

[Blacksuit00]

"Use Trusts" "Get Good" "You don't need to do this content lol."

You know what kind of players will dominate this game if this trend continues. I have seen many a game experiencing this.

It is simple: more grinding and unforgiving mechanism -> competitiveness and toxicity prevail; less grinding and unforgiving mechanism -> collaboration and friendship grow.

Yoshi-p has a choice, so do we all.

To those who mock casual players who have better things to tend to in real life: What are you afraid of?

The falsehood of the sense of superiority? From a Small Small dungeon? Your refusal to understand the Main Story?

You are entitled to enjoy the game your way, but not entitled to talk about other players in such a mean fashion.

Get good in your etiquette, please. How other players play the game is none of your business.

More grinding and unforgiving “ mechanism “ = Development of skill to cultivate your ability to execute mechanics competently, enjoyment, collaboration, catharsis and jubilation through trail and error and finally consummation and accomplishment.

Less grinding and unforgiving “ mechanism “ = Boredom, stagnation,regression, apathy, the reduction of people engaging with the content due to how facile it is.

[Higashikata]

it's fine, try playing with the trusts

[GeatsIX]

"Use Trusts" "Get Good" "You don't need to do this content lol."

You know what kind of players will dominate this game if this trend continues. I have seen many a game experiencing this.

It is simple: more grinding and unforgiving mechanism -> competitiveness and toxicity prevail; less grinding and unforgiving mechanism -> collaboration and friendship grow.

Yoshi-p has a choice, so do we all.

To those who mock casual players who have better things to tend to in real life: What are you afraid of?

The falsehood of the sense of superiority? From a Small Small dungeon? Your refusal to understand the Main Story?

You are entitled to enjoy the game your way, but not entitled to talk about other players in such a mean fashion.

Get good in your etiquette, please. How other players play the game is none of your business.

“Apathy is death. Worse than death, because at least a rotting corpse feeds the beasts and insects.” - Kreia