Give Warrior the Dark Knight treatment in regards to Bloodwhetting

[GoatOfWar]

No this has nothing to do with WAR being buffed in damage as in internal damage calculations, I mean why do the tanks as a collective now do 20-30% more damage than the collective healers in EW when up till ShB the tanks and healers maintained rough parity across the roles

The weakest tank was already ahead of the strongest healer in 6.0 so it’s not the WAR problem

Because one of them was given extra damage to make up for the fact that it had weaker sustain and utility than the others.
But as we already know, a certain Warrior main who happens to be a streamer got really, really angry about it. And his community parroted his talking points.
As a consequence, all the other tanks were buffed up (and now beyond) the level of the initial outlier, which was Dark knight.

[Sqwall]

Wat

20% Dr, 1600 heal potency, 12k shield on a 25s cooldown and it's UNDERPOWERED?

Compared to using Bloodwhetting in a dungeon setting with 10 mobs around you vs. one single savage boss....yeah it's pretty freaking underpowered in that regard.

I get NEARLY the same effect with Holy Sheltron in a savage setting. Holy Sheltron in dungeons is just pretty basic DR with no effort needed. Bloodwhetting kind of requires that I spam AOE or Burst to really truly shine.

[Oizen]

Compared to using Bloodwhetting in a dungeon setting with 10 mobs around you vs. one single savage boss....yeah it's pretty freaking underpowered in that regard.

I get NEARLY the same effect with Holy Sheltron in a savage setting. Holy Sheltron in dungeons is just pretty basic DR with no effort needed. Bloodwhetting kind of requires that I spam AOE or Burst to really truly shine.

So you're saying its a completely serviceable and powerful mitigation on the same level as the others in single target settings? That doesn't sound underpowered to me.
And honestly the fact you can guarantee crit heals just makes it stronger.

It sounds to me like that it really should just be once per GCD and not exponentially scale the healing you get into the fucking sun to the point where you could cut the heal potency in half in an aoe setting and I don't think you'd even notice, like so much of BW's healing just falls off because you're already capped.

[GoatOfWar]

Compared to using Bloodwhetting in a dungeon setting with 10 mobs around you vs. one single savage boss....yeah it's pretty freaking underpowered in that regard.

I get NEARLY the same effect with Holy Sheltron in a savage setting. Holy Sheltron in dungeons is just pretty basic DR with no effort needed. Bloodwhetting kind of requires that I spam AOE or Burst to really truly shine.

The standard you're setting for balance is the comical amounts of healing in AoE? BW is one of the most powerful tank cooldowns in the entire game even in single target combat.
And if you want to talk about effort, Warrior's sorta notorious for being the lowest effort tank in the game.

[rawker]

No this has nothing to do with WAR being buffed in damage as in internal damage calculations, I mean why do the tanks as a collective now do 20-30% more damage than the collective healers in EW when up till ShB the tanks and healers maintained rough parity across the roles

The weakest tank was already ahead of the strongest healer in 6.0 so it’s not the WAR problem

If my memory serves me right, Healer DPS used to surpass Tank DPS due to Cleric Stance. I hope they bring it back in DT.

[Sqwall]

The standard you're setting for balance is the comical amounts of healing in AoE? BW is one of the most powerful tank cooldowns in the entire game even in single target combat.
And if you want to talk about effort, Warrior's sorta notorious for being the lowest effort tank in the game.

I don't know...I would argue Holy Sheltron is stronger in raw damage reduction. No Gimmick, just hit it and forget it. Bloodwhetting is strong, but coupled with burst it's ridiculous.

Holy Sheltron by itself wins out imo. Bloodwhetting requires more GCD's to shine. Besides I have been told time and time again by my statics healers....PLD is WAY better at self sustain then WAR in savage. More mits, more dependable incoming healing from burst and non-burst, better invuln, stronger range. Only problems I see on PLD is it's damage output. My static healers have been way more comfortable on prog with me going PLD, so I would gladly sacrifice damage output for survivability. WAR was a blast to play, but I can't look at it now and think...yeah the mitigation is better.

Bloodwhetting is great, but it needs more GCD's to shine. PLD is just push button....done. IMO PLD requires way less effort then WAR. It just flows so much better....like it's self contained. No extra hoops to jump through. WAR always needed a little more planning with, "Tank buster incoming...pop Bloodwhetting, basic 1-2-3 combo after. Maybe I have an inner chaos". P6s was a GREAT example....tank buster every 2 min...Bloodwhetting, Burst....done. Healer never had to touch me. P12s...Tank busters were like 20 seconds before a 2 min burst. Didn't line up.

I have progged on WAR and PLD....I now choose PLD.

[PercibelTheren]

Compared to using Bloodwhetting in a dungeon setting with 10 mobs around you vs. one single savage boss....yeah it's pretty freaking underpowered in that regard.

I get NEARLY the same effect with Holy Sheltron in a savage setting. Holy Sheltron in dungeons is just pretty basic DR with no effort needed. Bloodwhetting kind of requires that I spam AOE or Burst to really truly shine.

In other words, it's not underpowered at all. It's just hilariously overpowered in dungeons.

[Supersnow845]

Because one of them was given extra damage to make up for the fact that it had weaker sustain and utility than the others.
But as we already know, a certain Warrior main who happens to be a streamer got really, really angry about it. And his community parroted his talking points.
As a consequence, all the other tanks were buffed up (and now beyond) the level of the initial outlier, which was Dark knight.

Which still doesn’t really answer my question because both the upper and lower outlier (DRK and WAR) were already far above the healers upper outlier (SCH) in 6.0

Every tank got buffed making the difference worse but WAR was already 20% stronger than SCH in 6.0, this was a conscious decision before the tank main YouTubers got involved in wanting everything buffed and I don’t understand why

I don't know...I would argue Holy Sheltron is stronger in raw damage reduction. No Gimmick, just hit it and forget it. Bloodwhetting is strong, but coupled with burst it's ridiculous.

Holy Sheltron by itself wins out imo. Bloodwhetting requires more GCD's to shine. Besides I have been told time and time again by my statics healers....PLD is WAY better at self sustain then WAR in savage. More mits, more dependable incoming healing from burst and non-burst, better invuln, stronger range. Only problems I see on PLD is it's damage output. My static healers have been way more comfortable on prog with me going PLD, so I would gladly sacrifice damage output for survivability. WAR was a blast to play, but I can't look at it now and think...yeah the mitigation is better.

Bloodwhetting is great, but it needs more GCD's to shine. PLD is just push button....done. IMO PLD requires way less effort then WAR. It just flows so much better....like it's self contained. No extra hoops to jump through. WAR always needed a little more planning with, "Tank buster incoming...pop Bloodwhetting, basic 1-2-3 combo after. Maybe I have an inner chaos". P6s was a GREAT example....tank buster every 2 min...Bloodwhetting, Burst....done. Healer never had to touch me. P12s...Tank busters were like 20 seconds before a 2 min burst. Didn't line up.

I have progged on WAR and PLD....I now choose PLD.

Does it not occur to you that healers ignoring you getting hit by savage tankbusters because of how hilariously overpowered the short CD’s are is a problem

[Aravell]

Every tank got buffed making the difference worse but WAR was already 20% stronger than SCH in 6.0, this was a conscious decision before the tank main YouTubers got involved in wanting everything buffed and I don’t understand why

The decision to widen the gap between the roles so much is a strange one considering that the DPS gap back in ARR/HW was so much closer to the point that a really good tank player can outdamage a sub-par DPS player.

Would be nice to see player skill matter again and not just job choice.

[GoatOfWar]

Which still doesn’t really answer my question because both the upper and lower outlier (DRK and WAR) were already far above the healers upper outlier (SCH) in 6.0

Every tank got buffed making the difference worse but WAR was already 20% stronger than SCH in 6.0, this was a conscious decision before the tank main YouTubers got involved in wanting everything buffed and I don’t understand why



Does it not occur to you that healers ignoring you getting hit by savage tankbusters because of how hilariously overpowered the short CD’s are is a problem

I don't know, i guess i started raiding in EW and it kinda makes sense to me the way it is now? It would be pretty bad if a job pressing literally 1 button did more dps than one with a full rotation.
When i look at Eden parses i giggle. I'd feel soooo bad about tanking if this were true now. That being said, if healers become obsolete by some omni jobs, (Looking at you warrior) i would agree that they should do the same dps as the jobs that invalidate them. Or rather, the ones invalidating them should drop down to the same dps as a healer.