XIV EW Job-Gameplay is Terrible... Why?

[Valence]

But we didn't burst every two min in ShB, that didn;t happen until EW. But if you wanna live in a world where consolidated combos work(they won't) then sure.

Never said I wanted to live in such a world and you're just putting words in my mouth. I merely stated that it can open for more possibilities of potentially interesting things than keeping those slots busy for a 1-2-3 stupid combo that does literally nothing skillful more than a 1-1-1 that changes visuals and potency at every attack. It's just an option that I find viable, if executed properly.

We bursted every two minutes in ShB for most jobs already for the simple reason that a lot of jobs either bursted every 120s already, or that the other third bursted every 60s ANYWAY (60s times 2 = 120s). Is your point about the few odd jobs that did every 90s, and some 180s raid wides that have even less to do about the design of combos?

I still fail to see what this has to do with how combos are designed whatsoever but okay.

[ty_taurus]

This made me snort and laugh...

So, in the last major patch for Genshin Impact, we got a new zone called Chanyu Vale, and in that zone is a side quest that takes you through what is basically this ancient armory for a famous clan that has been in power for centuries. Inside that zone, there's a combat challenge you can do to earn some chests that features AOE indicators that feel familiar to something like FFXIV, or SWTOR. That fight made an appearance in this Genshin streamer's video today. You can see the segment here.

The reason I bring this up is because you don't normally see this type of thing in Genshin, and she casually refers to these types of mechanics as "baby mode." It just makes me laugh because I feel like if that same attack pattern were in FFXIV in like a dungeon boss, we'd hear people complain about how hard it was. Granted Genshin does play differently, but having any more than like 2 AOE indicators at a time suddenly gets people accusing the fight of being too "dark souls."

[CelestiCer]

( snip ) The reason I bring this up is because you don't normally see this type of thing in Genshin, and she casually refers to these types of mechanics as "baby mode." It just makes me laugh because I feel like if that same attack pattern were in FFXIV in like a dungeon boss, we'd hear people complain about how hard it was. Granted Genshin does play differently, but having any more than like 2 AOE indicators at a time suddenly gets people accusing the fight of being too "dark souls."

Yay... Majority of the Unskippable/Roulette/MSQ/Openworld - Casual Content is deliberately not made exciting, with the supposed benefit of player-friendliness. It comes at the cost of excitement. Truly understandable to have pacing for 1st-Time-MSQ going through the story without to many bumps or roadblocks? But this is almost an insult at our skill-level, worse if we have to ever revisit it. Coupled with dull Job-Designs equals extra boring + activity not having it made worth doing other then that feeling of " This is the best way to conveniently get x or to level up x "

One good example comparison I had last night vs EW dungeons was the " Ixion Fate " on Dynamis. We could only gather 12+/- Players at 3 AM. We also started late, creating an actual DPS check on the 8 min that was left on it before it despawned. Boss was beefy in HP, mechanics were not the hardest, but punishing if you decided to greed it. With 3% left to go? we failed... We could have DC traveled and relied on a better time for more players? but what the failure did more is a sense of knowing this wasn't our best... and we can do better next time. I miss this in Endwalker. I don't get a sense of any of this, in fact? Square wants to make it so lazy that they add Duty Support so we can not play the game. How can a roided sparky Pony do better... all the way from freaking Stormblood vs the climactic ending of the story arc's PvE Dungeons... at max level I just had a different expectation I guess. I find this sad, mhm.

Sure don't make it harder for the sake of making it as hard as possible? but don't create it to the point we players can Afk most of it through Duty Support... that's just something else.

[Valence]

I honestly can't understand why they made duty support function on its own (provided one plays dps) without input from the player beyond moving forward.

[CelestiCer]

I honestly can't understand why they made duty support function on its own (provided one plays dps) without input from the player beyond moving forward.

A closer look at the mandatory MSQ to review what players can or likely will learn from its un-skippable PVE combat or difficulty worth mentioning as overcoming any level of stress as a potential to improve a player...

ARR - Nothing valuable to note. Story/Dungeons/Guildhests teaches nothing beyond " Press some Buttons ". Novice Hall adds nothing either. Job Quests aren't tailored either beyond go to point A and do/kill stuff at point B. Un-skippable Alliance Raid boils down to Monkey- See, Monkey-Do on their 1st run through.

HW - Aurum Vale notable soft wall for very inexperienced Tanks/Healers/MMO players. Just repeated Formula.

SB - Still teaching nothing about the expended Job Kits. Facing Zenos in Ala Mhigo perhaps the only likely Enrage up until now that players might fail.

SHB - Dungeon Mobs are beefy here. Square not directly teaching proper rotations is at the detriment of new)players time and patience. Facing Ran'jit as forced GNB Thancred teaches nothing proper.

EW - I had to actually explain Doom mechanics in Dead Ends, Troia and Lunar Subteranne multiple times with random parties. EW does RP force you to play other jobs while teaching again nothing & still repeated formula.
Note: Extra Trials / (Alliance)Raids / Eureka / Bojza / Deep Dungeon are all skippable content

Summary: Mandatory content teaches players nothing directly.

- Skills
- Rotation
- Slide Casting
- Uptime
- Positionals
- Mitigation
- Weaving / Clipping
- Understanding Debuffs
- Snapshots

Its not even about handholding either or spoon-feeding players on what to do at every given opportunity, not to give the wrong idea... rather about teaching players fundamentals/concepts/basics that are not even suggestively hinted to do throughout the MSQ... With near no clear positive feedback on rather or not players do anything correctly or better. Square expecting players to read Tool-Tips? is giving that idea to much credit. Don't Die or Die as much as you want while learning nothing is good enough to clear mandatory content, no matter how detrimental this is towards not encouraging players to improve to any degree -> " That = The Standard "

At least Yoshi-P recognizes that a completely stress-free game? comes at the cost of excitement. I see it coming at the cost of players who desire everything to be made dumber & easier as that's the standard they are accustomed to - Job Designs incl. Forget Combo-Compression, we have Duty Support so you don't need to press Buttons at all. Ironically? Our WoL lore-wise self-improves through overcoming adversity, hardships and challenges... the complete opposite of the bar Square sets for players, mhm.

[strawberrycake]

With Yoshida admitting he's went overboard and acknowledging he needs to make the game feel more MMO like, admiting they went overboard with how bosses were made this expansion, and the content feeling too samey, I wonder how DT will be.

[mallleable]

I'm expecting buff/burst standardization to mostly stay, but maybe some buffs get nerfed or removed. What I really hope they do is incorporate the ideas that were explored in pvp. To me, the pvp jobs uncovered the 'one small change' to a job that can have the most impact on its gameplay.

[Valence]

Unironically, pvp is the way to go. I'm kinda copiuming for pvp LBs being the lvl100 capstone skills of DT, especially if they consider alternative ways for 8.0 progression later down the road.