Discuss : is ffxiv in trouble

[Supersnow845]

The whole “manderville relics are the most successful relics because they have the highest engagement” is such a stupid argument that I can’t believe yoshi p actually said it

You know what else will raise relic engagement rates- dump all 21 into your inventory the second you log in on the new patch. 100% relic engagement ooooooooh ahhhhhhhhhh

Square enix my consultation fee is 200k per year

[Colt47]

The whole “manderville relics are the most successful relics because they have the highest engagement” is such a stupid argument that I can’t believe yoshi p actually said it

You know what else will raise relic engagement rates- dump all 21 into your inventory the second you log in on the new patch. 100% relic engagement ooooooooh ahhhhhhhhhh

Square enix my consultation fee is 200k per year

The issue has to do with how they look at data. They don't even register problems like how the time limited unreal content is dead and impossible to learn / do if someone doesn't do it in the first two weeks of release. Someone trying to do it now will be sitting forever in PF without a hope in the world of doing it. That and gear level itself has been isolated way too much to savage. I'm convinced the devs are literally scared to death of giving anyone access or progress to max iLvL patch gear through anything less than a savage because they think it will kill the content. If anything it would cut down the people doing savage to the ones that honestly want to do it. I'd rather do mid tier content and avoid the stress myself but they offer no alternatives.

[Jojoya]

The whole “manderville relics are the most successful relics because they have the highest engagement” is such a stupid argument that I can’t believe yoshi p actually said it

You know what else will raise relic engagement rates- dump all 21 into your inventory the second you log in on the new patch. 100% relic engagement ooooooooh ahhhhhhhhhh

Square enix my consultation fee is 200k per year

Their criteria for success are different from yours and some other players. It's not stupid when it's accurate with respect to their goals.

What the ultimate goal for MMORPG developers? Giving players reasons to keep repeat content they've already completed for as long as possible so they stay subscribed and help fill parties for other players getting to the content for the first time later.

Have the relics done that? Certainly. Players couldn't get tomestones for the relics and XP for any jobs they were still leveling at the same time. That meant repeating the content more to get both done.

Is the system at odds with what some players feel the role of the relics should be? Yep, but those players are too few in number compared to the number that the developers are trying to engage in repeating content. Like it or not, developers have to satisfy corporate bean counters with engagement numbers. When those numbers are too low, the bean counters decide the content is a waste of resources and tell the developers to do other things instead.

Fun fact: raiding almost died as a content option in WoW back in Burning Crusade. The participation numbers were so low that the bean counters told the developers to stop wasting time and money on raids. But the developers were very passionate about the raids they had created and didn't want to stop making them. They came up with the idea of 10 mans and an additional easier difficulty that would get more players into raiding. The bean counters gave them a chance to show it would work and it did. As the saying goes, the rest is history.

It's fine to dislike the system they've chosen. The real stupid argument is to pretend it wasn't successful from the corporate viewpoint when participation numbers indicate it clearly was.

So expect relics to continue to fill the "glamour is the real end game" role going forward instead of being symbols of achievement for those with too much time on their hands. Hopefully the new Field Operations zone announced last minute will have other rewards for those with the interest and time to invest in a grind, like the Al-iklil mount. Definitely don't see many of those around and anyone that knows the source knows what pain the owner had to go through to get it.

It's commonly said that FFXIV is "pog", but did you guys know that POG actually stands for "Play Other Games"? That's right, and FFXIV lets you play other games because having no content is respecting your time! For just $13 a month, I can pay another $15 a month to play a different MMO. Now that's poggers!

You claiming the game has no content and doesn't respect your time is even more stupid as an argument.

You're the one not respecting your time or your money. If the game isn't meeting your entertainment needs, it's up to you to stop paying and playing. It's not up to the game to change to suit you.

[strawberrycake]

Their criteria for success are different from yours and some other players. It's not stupid when it's accurate with respect to their goals.

What the ultimate goal for MMORPG developers? Giving players reasons to keep repeat content they've already completed for as long as possible so they stay subscribed and help fill parties for other players getting to the content for the first time later.

Have the relics done that? Certainly. Players couldn't get tomestones for the relics and XP for any jobs they were still leveling at the same time. That meant repeating the content more to get both done.

Is the system at odds with what some players feel the role of the relics should be? Yep, but those players are too few in number compared to the number that the developers are trying to engage in repeating content. Like it or not, developers have to satisfy corporate bean counters with engagement numbers. When those numbers are too low, the bean counters decide the content is a waste of resources and tell the developers to do other things instead.

Fun fact: raiding almost died as a content option in WoW back in Burning Crusade. The participation numbers were so low that the bean counters told the developers to stop wasting time and money on raids. But the developers were very passionate about the raids they had created and didn't want to stop making them. They came up with the idea of 10 mans and an additional easier difficulty that would get more players into raiding. The bean counters gave them a chance to show it would work and it did. As the saying goes, the rest is history.

It's fine to dislike the system they've chosen. The real stupid argument is to pretend it wasn't successful from the corporate viewpoint when participation numbers indicate it clearly was.

So expect relics to continue to fill the "glamour is the real end game" role going forward instead of being symbols of achievement for those with too much time on their hands. Hopefully the new Field Operations zone announced last minute will have other rewards for those with the interest and time to invest in a grind, like the Al-iklil mount. Definitely don't see many of those around and anyone that knows the source knows what pain the owner had to go through to get it.


You claiming the game has no content and doesn't respect your time is even more stupid as an argument.

You're the one not respecting your time or your money. If the game isn't meeting your entertainment needs, it's up to you to stop paying and playing.

You know theres a saying, if a person spends more time trying rationalize why a corporation does what it over meeting the peoples needs, they're part of the problem. So hows that boot taste?

Also 10 man Raids and Hard mode raids historically were STILL too hard for casuals and they ends up making LFR, which was still too hard for casuals, they then made Mythic + and Mythic raiding and the easier difficulties were still too hard for casuals and now all of that is now geared towards raiders and raid prog.

So your point now boils down to, why cater to casuals who always whine about how they aren't catered to, when they are and still aren't happy.

[Jojoya]

You know theres a saying, if a person spends more time trying rationalize why a corporation does what it over meeting the peoples needs, they're part of the problem. So hows that boot taste?

The game meets my needs. It meets the needs of my friends. That's why we're all still playing it. It may not meet all of our wants, but that's okay. Nothing is perfect.

The game apparently doesn't meet your needs. Why do you keep chewing on the boot you hate instead of chewing on one you like?

Also, I can't find any results for that saying on Google. Did you just make it up on the spot? Only a fool thinks that a corporation can meet the needs of all people. Not everyone has the same needs.

[strawberrycake]

And Historically catering to casual players ends up with bad games. So again, hows that boot taste?

[Jojoya]

And Historically catering to casual players ends up with bad games. So again, hows that boot taste?

That's so false I wonder where you're pulling that information from. The most successful games have always been friendly to casual players.

Another situation of what is bad to you is good to others. It's entirely subjective.

You can keep throwing feeble insults at me if you want. I'll go make some popcorn.

[Astrus]

And Historically catering to casual players ends up with bad games. [...]

Now I'm curious what metric you are basing that statement on because if "bad" means "commercially unsuccessful" the opposite seems to be true.
A good chunk of commercially successful games cater to casual players.
If "bad" in that context simply means "not to your taste" that may be true but irrelevant to everyone except yourself.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

And Historically catering to casual players ends up with bad games. So again, hows that boot taste?

Wikdstar anyone? Game made for hardcore people that failed.

[Astrus]

Wikdstar anyone? Game made for hardcore people that failed.

ngl, I miss Wildstar. For all the "wrong" reasons. Their housing was something else and I liked the wacky world.