These Relics Aren't Relicing

[Erzaa]

Yes it is this does not, however, mean that you neglect trying to funnel some or a lot of players into doing or trying the content. Personally, if it takes upwards an hour to get into a queue with the high probability of needing to cycle a given set of floors multiple times because the game elected to not give sufficient amount of Aetherpool. – Then I see that as somewhat of an issue. If people cannot get past that initial hurdle of farming Aetherpool without essentially being told to do it all solo, then you’re likely to experience players that may like the content, otherwise dropping it because of frankly poor support for it.

Except, by design the game is telling you it doesn't want to funnel you into PoTD. It wants you to run DSR, that's why they drop a guaranteed 3 instead of 1. PotD is the alternative for players who don't particularly enjoy raiding or relying on others.

You also need to consider the simple fact there are always people doing relics. Over a decade later, tonnes of people still do ARR relics. Over 5 years later – People are still doing Eureka relics, and arguably has some of the best shelf life of any given content.

Yes, it is bad, and they are given it bountifully, and even more so under the premise that people were already doing the content which offers it anyway. My point was that relative to how the content was, it is more tedious to progress that given step. – The emphasis on more.

I never said otherwise. I've done multiple of them, years after they were relevant, and they're all mostly tedious, even ARR and HW which can be done entirely solo now. PotD isn't that bad, IF you run it as intended.

Your calculation wrests under the expectation that the only content people are engaging with in order to progress the relic is roulettes. If you are doing hunts, and if you are engaging with hunts even semi-actively then you progress an entire relic in 2 days, not just 1 step, and this is from scratch. On the other hand I could do a quick hunt calculation. Let's say you do hunts, there's 12 hunts, you have 8 servers, and each hunt gives 20 tomes, that's 240 per 12 hunts, which is 1 server. Multiply this across 8 servers, you then have 1920 tomes for a complete set of trains. Each A-Rank takes 4-6 hours to respawn, give a tiny bit of leeway for the train to be scouted. That's already 1920, and this doesn't factor in ARR/HW morning trains, or the occasional SB and ShB trains which give a further up-to 120, in between downtimes you can also do your roulettes. They aren't even remotely on par LOL

No, you're speaking entirely hypothetically here. My arguments rely on realism. Most people don't have the time to farm 1920 causality tomes in a single day. We work and we have other life responsibilities. Real life doesn't work that way. Did you miss the part where I said I did 2 relics at the same time, and it took me 4 days, farming after work hours? They're very much on par. You could take a Saturday morning and work through a 10 hour sitting, and rng willing, you'd have your 15 artifacts. Just because something is theoretically possible, doesn't make it realistic.

The reason why Endwalker relics should be harder to get, but the Bozjan relics easier? Well I don’t know – Maybe because for all intents and purposes outside of glamour, the Bozjan relic is near enough entirely irrelevant. Endwalker on the other hand is the current best weapon. Granted, it is the contrary in that Endwalker relics take less time to get than you apparently took to progress 1 step, and that is just a fact.

Then I guess I shouldn't have run Nier 100+ times to get the glamour items from there either. They're no longer relevant. They should drop one for every player, every run. If something's popular, and the person wants it bad enough, they'll suffer through the tedium.

Nah you an unequivocally say they all have been nerfed. Eureka takes maybe 4 days to progress a relic from start to finish, and arguably currently I would say it is still less of a grind than Bozjan. Why HW and SB? Well..
HW to my knowledge went from having, what? 3 Luminary Crystals per zone, in addition to the abysmal drop rate – To only needing I believe 1 per zone, on top of a significantly increased drop rate.
The fact all of it is dungeons, trials, etc., means it benefitted indirectly from undersized. Previously, it was what? Farm A1N, and Brayflox on bonus… Now you just farm A5S or A9S, and the game basically hands out light like candy, because you know… Level 60 isn’t exactly threatening to Level 90s

SB? The relics for Pagos were nerfed into oblivion. Vitiated light increased dramatically, and I mean dramatically. Then the crystal yield was doubled on those in something like 4.57, then you had the nerfs to the required level to attune to specific aetherytes across the zones. This made traversing a lot easier, and then the echo buff just overall made it significantly easier on top of how it was. Pazuzu would take people out in troves, now he’s barely a threat, as are the monsters needed to spawn him, and anyone else in Eureka. I don’t have a strong recollection of Anemos, Pyros, nor Hydatos aside from those.

So, absolutely yes HW and SB were absolutely, unequivocally, definitively nerfed.

Again, a fallacious argument. It's still a long tedious grind, far more than just running PotD for 2 days. I've not met a single person who's completed their first Eureka start to finish in 4 days, leveling and a relic. https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/wiki/Eurekan_Weapons. Take a look at the amounts of crystals you need per each area, that's not even accounting for the time required for a new player to level in Eureka, just the weapons. By your argument, I could just say it's possible to hit rank 20 on Island Sanctuary in a few days if I spent 16 hours a day gathering, but it isn't realistic or practical.

As for the final point, like I said, because it incentivises more people to actually do PotD, which would probably help more people to actually like it since queues won’t be punishing, or because they wouldn’t need to go through the ordeal of soloing the place on 0AP, and 0 of the tradeable potions. All I did was specify a justification as to why I thought it would be a good idea for that particular step, and beneficial to the overall player base. The subsequent and final step to the relic is an entirely different discussion which doesn’t suffer the same problem as the Augmented Law’s Order weapon, IMO. But if you want to go there, then yes, they could add dungeons, but again, I just think it’s killing more birds with 1 stone to increase or guaranteed the rate on certain floors. The only saving grace with the resistance relics is much of the grind on the other stages is just a 1-time step thing.

It's very much a relevant argument. Their drop rates are about on par with each other. And the step with HoH includes dungeons which disincentivises running HoH, which means the queues you speak of will still be non-existent. Players will always flock to what's fastest. The only reason anyone complains about PotD during that step is because they don't want to climb the floors and want an easy and quick method. The one-time steps aren't relevant here, they're designed to be grindy for the duration of the expansion. The subsequent weapons are all tedious but not in any terrible way, PotD drop rate is decent, just run the floors from 1-150 normally and you'll be done in no time. Running 51-60, you're basically gambling against the odds and complaining you didn't win the lottery. If they increase the drop rate fine, if they add dungeons fine. And I'm not saying it would helpful or not helpful. I personally don't care if they increased the drop rate or not. But the argument that PotD is somehow tedious, when players are deliberately ignoring the way it was intended to be run, that's a player problem.