Ranked Rewards

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

Incentive =/= reward. A reason to play is not the same thing as only doing something because you get a treat at the end directly from the game. People can just as easily do something because they find it enjoyable or the pride of achieving something. There doesn't always have to be something at the end.

I'm not talking about how games are designed, I'm talking about how players approach games and things they want to do in said games.

Again - we have an excess of things we like doing for enjoyability and limited time in our life. Running things purely on hopes and dreams that people will do it for enjoyability alone is no longer enough for players to be interested in doing so. Player approach changed with excess of entertainment available, players have to make a choice between Option A that is very fun to them and Option B that is very fun to them and [offers additional benefits/drops specific restrictions] over option A.

[Doozer]

Again - we have an excess of things we like doing for enjoyability and limited time in our life. Running things purely on hopes and dreams that people will do it for enjoyability alone is no longer enough for players to be interested in doing so. Player approach changed with excess of entertainment available, players have to make a choice between Option A that is very fun to them and Option B that is very fun to them and [offers additional benefits/drops specific restrictions] over option A.

I'm not talking about game design. And you're just proving my point, that players now are more likely to do something with a tangible reward than they used to. Stop trying to say I'm wrong just because I'm saying something different from what you're saying.

I do plenty of things in a variety of games just because they have meaning to me and not because I get something shiny afterwards. This is what I'm talking about.

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

I'm not talking about game design. And you're just proving my point, that players now are more likely to do something with a tangible reward than they used to. Stop trying to say I'm wrong just because I'm saying something different from what you're saying.

I do plenty of things in a variety of games just because they have meaning to me and not because I get something shiny afterwards. This is what I'm talking about.

You can't talk about the change of human behaviour in regards how they interact with games without reaching a tangent with game design and competition of entertainment to cite as a reason. Also I never said you are wrong, I simply provided answers to why the behaviour changed.

That said, look - I am glad you specifically and people thinking like you are able to things purely because they have meaning to you or bring you enjoyment. Frankly, a vast amount of players ISN'T like you and would like at least some form of tangible progress being made somewhere. It won't exactly go back to the old ways either because we simply have too many things that we enjoy or are potentially enjoyable. It is a fool's errand expecting or hoping it will.

[Doozer]

You can't talk about the change of human behaviour in regards how they interact with games without reaching a tangent with game design and competition of entertainment to cite as a reason. Also I never said you are wrong, I simply provided answers to why the behaviour changed.

That said, look - I am glad you specifically and people thinking like you are able to things purely because they have meaning to you or bring you enjoyment. Frankly, a vast amount of players ISN'T like you and would like at least some form of tangible progress being made somewhere. It won't exactly go back to the old ways either because we simply have too many things that we enjoy or are potentially enjoyable. It is a fool's errand expecting or hoping it will.

Then maybe instead of just trying to appease the iPad babies that can't do anything without colourful fruit praising them for their actions, maybe question why we should allow it to be that way in the first place. It's not about tangible "progress", it's about wanting a trophy because knowing you did it isn't enough which, quite frankly, is a bit childish. It reminds me of people who cheat in competitions because they want the reward and not the sense of accomplishment that goes along with it. And no, before you knee-jerk react to that, I'm not equating people wanting a treat for shaking a paw to cheating.

[Aubrey_A]

why we should allow it to be that way in the first place. It's not about tangible "progress", it's about wanting a trophy because knowing you did it isn't enough which, quite frankly, is a bit childish.

I mean, ranked won't get my time or effort unless that carrot does exist. Even back during feast times, some rewards were not a good enough carrot to incentivize me to play. In my case, there is already enough good going on in both XIV and other parts of my life that the thrill of ranked competition doesn't do it for me anymore. I might not be the most wanted type of player in the ranked queue for that reason. That being said, with the queues as small as they are, I don't view my standpoint of requiring a carrot as childish.

If the carrots are what keep the ques rolling across unranked - crystal, then I would say add more carrots. I don't think the ranked system has enough going for it to keep players retained.

[Doozer]

I mean, ranked won't get my time or effort unless that carrot does exist. Even back during feast times, some rewards were not a good enough carrot to incentivize me to play. In my case, there is already enough good going on in both XIV and other parts of my life that the thrill of ranked competition doesn't do it for me anymore. I might not be the most wanted type of player in the ranked queue for that reason. That being said, with the queues as small as they are, I don't view my standpoint of requiring a carrot as childish.

If the carrots are what keep the ques rolling across unranked - crystal, then I would say add more carrots. I don't think the ranked system has enough going for it to keep players retained.

If you need bait to do something, then clearly you don't want to do that thing in the first place. Maybe instead of putting something behind doing it, the content should actually just be fun to do. Not something you endure to get the thing you want.

[Aubrey_A]

If you need bait to do something, then clearly you don't want to do that thing in the first place. Maybe instead of putting something behind doing it, the content should actually just be fun to do. Not something you endure to get the thing you want.

I think that helps narrow down the issue then. I'm almost to 3000 CC/feast/fold matches via casual queues, working towards Alpha Wolf slowly. To me, the difference between Ranked and Casual is the ranking system itself, and the stakes of the players playing each mode. Those two don't make the mode fun for me, so I don't choose to do it. The carrot gets me to jump into ranked though.

This pertains to my experiences only, but I think the game mode is a ton of fun. Can the rank mode be made to be more fun? I hope it can, but I won't hold my breath for it.

[joansbones]

If you need bait to do something, then clearly you don't want to do that thing in the first place. Maybe instead of putting something behind doing it, the content should actually just be fun to do. Not something you endure to get the thing you want.

you could say this thing about literally every piece of content in ffxiv

why do you think criterion is dead? it's not because it's bad content.

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

If you need bait to do something, then clearly you don't want to do that thing in the first place. Maybe instead of putting something behind doing it, the content should actually just be fun to do. Not something you endure to get the thing you want.

I see this comment every damn time rewards get brought up for Ranked and I am tired as hell of this regurgitated and bullshit response.

Crystalline Conflict is fun. Ranked is fun. Casual is fun. Both are CC. Casual is Ranked with basically the same relevant rewards (trophy crystals) with none of the restrictions (limited playerpools to facilitate ranked queues because Crystal shouldn't play with silver). I get to play Crystalline Conflict casual steadily rather than having to encourage people to try queue for 15-30min and pray they stay. Waiting for queue is NOT fun and many rankers go into casual for fast queues because they got no reason to do ranked.