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  1. #11
    Player
    NanaWiloh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    2,448
    Character
    Nana Wiloh
    World
    Lamia
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by DrWho2010 View Post
    A GM/Community Manager cannot be seen to be responding directly to player feedback/suggestions with any kind of opinion. It is not their job to comment on such things.

    If they agree with the poster, then it can be interpreted as a promise that it will be coming and when it doesn't, the pitchforks will be hoisted and shouts of "liar, liar" will be too much.

    If they disagree with the poster, then it can be interpreted as ignoring a paying customer, or be taken personally by the poster and who knows what kind of outcome that could lead to, because people be crazy sometimes.

    It's lose / lose for direct interaction.
    This says it all and why its left to Yoshi to acknowledge feedback if he chooses to do so.
    (0)

  2. #12
    Player
    Sindele's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    491
    Character
    Sindele Actoria
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 96
    Communicating back and forth with players is almost uniformly a mistake on big projects for two reasons.

    One: people on the internet do not behave like reasonable people, and using punitive methods to force it to be a reasonable space is a full-time job and will create even more problems and more work - ban evasion, review bombing, social media attacks, etc. The moderation here is lacking, sure, but lacking moderation does not explain why it's a dumpster fire in the first place. That's all on the people - and in practice you'll find that they're not going to magically behave vastly differently, they're just going to be periodically kicked out of the pool, and they're going to lash out over it.

    Two: most purpose-driven feedback is less useful than sentiment mining from players talking to each other. The long story short of why can be summed up by this Neil Gaiman quote from his storytelling masterclass: "Remember: when people tell you something's wrong or doesn't work for them, they are almost always right. When they tell you exactly what they think is wrong and how to fix it, they are almost always wrong." Unfortunately, most player feedback tries to focus on desired changes, which might as well be filed directly to a shredder for how useful they are. Players complaining to each other tends to be a lot more purely useful - CM/dev presence is actively harmful to that.
    (4)

  3. #13
    Player
    VerdeLuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Posts
    1,112
    Character
    Ymir Bombullshale
    World
    Halicarnassus
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    There is a community team for the game but they pretty much only listen to the JP side. Look at all the responses the community team gives the JP side of the forums.
    Here, we have 2 posts made by community streamers advertising their streams and introducting themselves, and then never posting again, along with the occasional GM moving a thread here or there.

    They absolutely do not care about feedback from NA at all, they do not care to check on feedback or provide anything back unless you're one of a handful of streamers and influencers.
    I have submitted bug reports on various job gauges having broken transparencies a month and a half ago and I have yet to get any response back on whether it's being investigated or has been thrown in the trash.
    We have been giving feedback about Viera and Hroth headgear and hairstyles for 4 years with no response and no work done on it. Not even an acknowledgement of our issues or feedback.
    At the same time there's clear, open feedback with the CN side, the KR side, and the JP side of the game with even some special changes to accomodate their players.

    We cant even get live letters in a language we can understand without volunteer amateur translators from reddit translating it for us.
    Face it, Japanese companies really do not care about the NA players base, we're a nice to have, but we are not the main customers and we will never be catered to or thought of when they are designing content for the game or looking at problems.
    The devs are always going to trot over to the JP forums and read that instead.
    (1)
    Last edited by VerdeLuck; 12-18-2023 at 06:33 AM.

  4. #14
    Player
    NanaWiloh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    2,448
    Character
    Nana Wiloh
    World
    Lamia
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by VerdeLuck View Post
    There is a community team for the game but they pretty much only listen to the JP side. Look at all the responses the community team gives the JP side of the forums.
    Here, we have 2 posts made by community streamers advertising their streams and introducting themselves, and then never posting again, along with the occasional GM moving a thread here or there.

    They absolutely do not care about feedback from NA at all, they do not care to check on feedback or provide anything back unless you're one of a handful of streamers and influencers.
    I have submitted bug reports on various job gauges having broken transparencies a month and a half ago and I have yet to get any response back on whether it's being investigated or has been thrown in the trash.
    We have been giving feedback about Viera and Hroth headgear and hairstyles for 4 years with no response and no work done on it. Not even an acknowledgement of our issues or feedback.
    At the same time there's clear, open feedback with the CN side, the KR side, and the JP side of the game with even some special changes to accomodate their players.

    We cant even get live letters in a language we can understand without volunteer amateur translators from reddit translating it for us.
    Face it, Japanese companies really do not care about the NA players base, we're a nice to have, but we are not the main customers and we will never be catered to or thought of when they are designing content for the game or looking at problems.
    The devs are always going to trot over to the JP forums and read that instead.
    Blizzard does same thing to non NA players. Treats them like second class customers. What goes around comes around..
    (2)

  5. #15
    Player
    OgruMogru's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    683
    Character
    Ogru Magnataraxia
    World
    Lich
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 100
    Meanwhile EU sitting over here like NA's unnoticed blackened septic appendix.
    (2)

  6. #16
    Player
    VerdeLuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Posts
    1,112
    Character
    Ymir Bombullshale
    World
    Halicarnassus
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by NanaWiloh View Post
    Blizzard does same thing to non NA players. Treats them like second class customers. What goes around comes around..
    I don't play Blizzard games so I really don't care about what they do.
    (0)
    Last edited by VerdeLuck; 12-18-2023 at 07:35 AM.

  7. #17
    Player
    NanaWiloh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    2,448
    Character
    Nana Wiloh
    World
    Lamia
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by VerdeLuck View Post
    I don't play Blizzard games so I really don't care about what they do.
    Ya and Blizzard handles their feedback in the same manner. If your not NA your feedback is meaningless.,Just how SE treats NA feedback as meaningless.
    (0)

  8. #18
    Player
    kyyninen_kirahvi's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2022
    Posts
    85
    Character
    Sami'a Amriyo
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by OgruMogru View Post
    Meanwhile EU sitting over here like NA's unnoticed blackened septic appendix.
    It's somthing that happens every time with few exeptions. I mean the French and German have their own forums. The rest of Europe has to scatter where they can... (I know all 24 official EU languages is not possible, but still)
    (1)
    Last edited by kyyninen_kirahvi; 12-18-2023 at 07:43 AM. Reason: broken thought

  9. #19
    Player
    VerdeLuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Posts
    1,112
    Character
    Ymir Bombullshale
    World
    Halicarnassus
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by NanaWiloh View Post
    Ya and Blizzard handles their feedback in the same manner. If your not NA your feedback is meaningless.,Just how SE treats NA feedback as meaningless.
    I still do not care in the slightest how Blizzard handles their community. Go post about it on their forums.
    (0)

  10. #20
    Player
    Rolder50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Posts
    1,615
    Character
    Alarasong Elaha
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 91
    Either they don't have one or the ones they do have do not feel a need to interact with the community. Either way, we can see why they didn't win the best Community Support award eh?
    (4)

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