For those who main/semi-main a DPS (e.g. DNC, RDM) but like Healers...

[Renathras]

God I wish you wouldn't make bad faith posts.

It's impossible for a set of criteria that broad to be incapable of creating something rewarding for any given player unless the player just doesn't like the game at all.

WHY do you CONSTANTLY do this?

"It's so broad anything I would like is covered. The fact what you want isn't covered just means you don't like the game at all." is what you just said. While also calling me confrontational.

Can you please read what I originally posted?

No, this was an in general question. People very often say that Healers spam their basic spamnuke 80% of the time or so, but that number doesn't seem to match reality outside of some 6.0 chadding WHMs, maybe.

Me: I don't think it matters what I say, you've already made up your mind about what I want.
You: That's a cop out.
Me: Okay, fine. This is how I feel about the idea of a support role.
You: We both know what your real answer is.

Except...this isn't how that conversation went, is it?

Me: Here's a question, Ty.
You: I refuse to answer that question, you've already decided what I would say.
Me: No I haven't. That's why I asked the question.
You: Yes, you have! So I refuse to answer it.
Me: The only reason I can think of is if you would have answered it X. But please clarify if this is or is not what you think?
You: SEE! You've proven my point you've already decided what I would say!
Me: I literally asked you - twice - to say what your position is.
You: IT DOESN'T MATTER! YOU'VE ALREADY DECIDED WHAT I WOULD SAY!!

The lesson here is I DIDN'T do "exactly what (you) said (I)'d do". I literally asked you, I think THREE TIMES. Only when you refused to answer did I say I can only think of one reason offhand for you to do so, which would be if your answer was X. But even there, I gave you the freedom to clarify.

Instead of clarifying, you chose YET AGAIN to not answer the question, and YET AGAIN insisted that I was doing a thing I wasn't doing.

When I ask you - multiple times - a question, it's because I'm NOT "deciding what you would say".

I didn't ignore your ANSWER because you didn't give one.

And I didn't ignore your RESPONSE, I addressed it directly, calling it a cop out.

For the love of god, man, at least don't outright lie. <_<

The lesson here is: When someone asks you a question, give a good faith answer. You might be surprised how well things work out when you AREN'T being evasive and duplicitous. And the worst part is, as I said before, it's even pointless for you to BE evasive on this. I outright said I'd try out a Support role/Job if one was introduced, so that should have diffused any concern you had that if you answered you'd try it out I'd call you "not a real healer".

...that and that I don't say of people here "you aren't a real healer". Both you and Roe have used that canard, insisting I do it, when I'm the one of us that HASN'T.

[ty_taurus]

God I wish you wouldn't make bad faith posts.

I wish you wouldn't make bad faith posts.

WHY do you CONSTANTLY do this?

Because...

You. Are. Wrong. Say it with me.

You are treating what should be general standards of class design in a cooldown-based RPG as some sort of hyper-specific playstyle. Ensuring a job doesn't spent too much time spamming any one button and regularly engages with healthy number of actions should be the standard for every job. In Ren-Land, perhaps that is an unreasonable request, like asking a group of people who don't know how to read or play music to man the violin, the trumpet, and the flute, and you're here crying out for the option to play the triangle. But in the real world, It's asking for basic standards of job design. I know you don't like standards, but game designers shouldn't care about players who don't want to engage with the combat system, because then why make that combat system to begin with? If I want to appeal to you and people who are as disinterested in the combat system as you are, I would make FFXIV into an idle game where each job has one action.

I sympathize with players who want to heal without DPSing. I do not sympathize with players who want a job that can be played with 1-4 buttons where the game is designed around having around 28-32.

Except...this isn't how that conversation went, is it?

Except it is how the conversation went. You just didn't read. You remember when you tried to burn me at the stake for glossing over one of your posts and responding to it?

First of all, I'm not looking to play a role on principle. What I care about is what the job is and how it plays. I have nothing against a support role.

^ The simple answer I gave first.

The fact that you decided to answer for me is exactly why I say that you've made up your mind on what I want. Is that not obvious to you? You're wrong by the way, because your answer severely lacks context for what happens to the other roles. In your hypothetical world where the support role is added as a 4th, are the healers fixed, or do they stay hot feces for the rest of eternity? Because if your idea of adding the support role is specifically to allow the healers to remain in the ass tier of design quality, then obviously I'm going to go for support because there is no healer role to go to. If the healer role is allowed to be fixed, then I'm going to play the healer role and would probably be a Sage one-trick. Would I try the support jobs? I suppose technically I would when I level them to 100, since I level every job to max level, but I'd probably never actively try to play it or queue as it. Depending on what the new caster DPS will be, I might either make that my back-pocket DPS for when I can't heal (like if I'm doing treasure maps with my FC and someone else wants to heal) or maybe I'd keep that as Dancer. If the caster is Onmyoji, there's a good chance I might swap to that if the healer role continues to be defecated on because I like that concept. Whether or not Dancer remains in the physical ranged DPS role or the new support role is irrelevant to me.

^ The detailed answer I gave second after you continued to tell me to just admit I'd play support. If you want to crucify me on the forums, try actually reading what I write first. You are the liar here.