XVI and XIV implications

[Ilyn]

I think FFxvi is gonna lead cbu3 into making their next mainline FF game an action mmo tbh . If what I see in Chrono Odyssey is what gaming might progress to w/ Gfx and scale in the future I have no reason not to think this might be the direction they'll be going with . I actually won't mind it as FFxvi is almost the same a DC Universe Online , you could use like 10 different weapon types which all had unique action combos while you could choose 6 abilities that were on cds from multiple skill trees. It was actually some of the most fun I've every had especially as far as pvp is concerned .

[Rufalus]

3. Exploration and creativity is not going to get fostered or done well for the rest of XIV's life imo. CBU III enjoys heavily guiding and restricting players to exactly what they want them to do and nothing else.

A giant lobby where everyone just sits around doing nothing after the MSQ and insta queuing to linear dungeons over and over again is really tired imo.

This gradually beat down my hope. I started out as a super fan. ARR was pretty good for a 2013 game done to a rushed schedule with expectations of a much smaller playerbase. The game began to thrive, the playerbase and revenue grew massively, they've had 10 more years to map out its evolution.

Evolution never came. The MSQ chain that started in ARR just continued on forever in much the same manner. Through that we unlock dungeons, they are all formatted the same way with corridor and 3 bosses, worthless loot. We still collect tomes and replace all of our gear each new season with basically the same stuff but +30 item level added. Any new ideas get isolated in side content bubbles so they can't affect the rest of the game.

Games used to only do this in their dying days, the maintenance mode. Maintain the old systems and just plug content into that template. This game has done it the entire lifetime, stick within the rigid walls of the template they launched with, same core content delivered in the same familiar pattern.

[kpxmanifesto]

Games used to only do this in their dying days, the maintenance mode. Maintain the old systems and just plug content into that template. This game has done it the entire lifetime, stick within the rigid walls of the template they launched with, same core content delivered in the same familiar pattern.

Yeah, SE is sticking to a formula that works out for them and doesn't bring on too much risk. Probably the only way to spur any major change is if the players vote with their wallets.

[Raikai]

One way or another. by the JP Fanfest next year (also with other sources), we'll probably have more of a confirmation about the way XIV is going to sail. People here say that they'll stick to their formula no matter what, but that's true until it's not, and 7.0 - with all it represents with new beginnings - will be a decisive point for veterans who are not quite satisfied with the state of the game right now.

Which is my case. If the formula repeats in 7.0, I'll probably just play for the part that I like, which is the story, and unsub until the last patch, so I can experience the rest of it without breaks.

[RitsukoSonoda]

It will continue to be a dream for the distant future. FF16 level graphics are not mmo friendly and would work against it more then for it. MMO seek to be accessible to as many players as possible. Graphics like FF16 would restrict how many can actually play the game. One of FF16s cut scenes in graphics mode has reported caused ps5s to overheat. Just think what a hunt with 50 players and FF16 level graphics would do..

I'd say they should have learned their lesson on that with FF14 1.0. The game was so overtuned it was eating the hardware of anything running it that wasn't a top tier gaming PC at the time. ARR actually scaled the graphics back.

[Ath192]

I'd say they should have learned their lesson on that with FF14 1.0. The game was so overtuned it was eating the hardware of anything running it that wasn't a top tier gaming PC at the time. ARR actually scaled the graphics back.

There were a lot of contributing factors to the laggy feeling of 1.0. I bought it on launch day and could play it on my laptop on medium graphics 30 FPS. It was a 1K Dell XPS 1645. The problem was that the menus rendered server side, so you know that awful ping we have in this game? well... Apply it to most menus in game and all of a sudden it will take you 3 seconds to even open up your character profile.

Not saying it wasn't a heavy game but the truth is a lot more convoluted than just high graphics. It was a gorgeous game however.

[NanaWiloh]

I'd say they should have learned their lesson on that with FF14 1.0. The game was so overtuned it was eating the hardware of anything running it that wasn't a top tier gaming PC at the time. ARR actually scaled the graphics back.

Vanguard saga of heroes had hefty pc requirements. Add on the fact that it was eq2 style mmo and the number of people who could actually play was small by comparison to other less intense mmos.

[PercibelTheren]

Abundance of fast travel points IMO is one of those things claimed to be a QoL improvement that really was just an appeasement for lazy gamers that chose to spend more time whining about it than just playing the actual game. It also essentially invalidates the effort in crafting the world since they're also making it so people don't see 90% of it because they're just bamf'ing all over the place like they're Nightcrawler.

I disagree with this. The world of Eorzea is huge at this point and having to fly/walk everywhere would be a massive chore. Hell, even doing MSQ is a massive chore because you have to walk places. The blame for that lays squarely on how the zones are designed and the fact that there is hardly anything of interest in them. Just bunches of enemies who will aggro onto you if you get too close and...that's it. If you want me to travel through the world, give me something to do. A huge help would be allowing us to enable gathering node detection skills to be on without having to switch to the appropriate job. Walking from point A to point B would feel a lot less like a waste of time if you could gather something useful along the way. I know they tried to make dynamic events with FATEs, but they, for the most part, failed miserably. At least the older ones have fun lore tidbits you can discover (like that girl whose boyfriends get eaten by sand worms so often she doesn't even bother remembering her names anymore), I guess.

Besides, if you made people walk/fly everywhere, the only thing that would happen is people would take the shortest possible route. They wouldn't explore the zones anyway. If you want your players to be doing exploration, you have to give them incentive. Looking at other open-world games, this is usually achieved through stuff like collectibles or achievements. RIFT encouraged you to go to weird nooks and crannies because you could get artifacts. Genshin Impact hides chests with loot all over the place and has something you can gather scattered all over every zone. These two aren't really an option for XIV unless they are willing to make a major overhaul, unfortunately. What they could do are achievements. Climb the highest mountain, visit all the hidden caves, etc. But then I guess they would have to update the achievement vendor first.

[Shougun]

It's weird to say, but I would almost prefer the smaller chunked XVI type maps over what we have in XIV now. It's clear they know how to make a visually stunning game with great mid-sized areas. Give me more of that in XIV.

XVI gutted a lot of what we expect from FF games in general, and that alone scares me for both future FF games, and XIV. It did introduce some sick boss fights, so if we ever keep anything from CBU:III I want it to be some form of boss DDR combat.

I just want to toss out a game like Ghost of Tsushima where exploration in an open space was done very well. Given all the sounds, visuals, and mechanics going on.. exploration was so seamless it disturbed me that it was one of the first times I felt it to that tier. Like, sure I play GoW and I know it's a good game with a lot of polish, but playing GoT was like "this exploration is good enough it bothers me". I think in part it helped there was so many things of value not of check boxes. Say ubisoft is the king of checkboxes. Plz staph that. FFXVI hardly had 'valuable' exploration or 'useless value' exploration, thankfully they designed their game knowing that wasn't something they were selling lol (the maps are simple and nothing is really hidden), it would have been nice though, still, if they could refine that.

Even IF they were going to keep really linear maps* I would hope they can improve their side rewards, like side quests and reducing the number of items on the map (but making them more valuable to offset that). The quests that did things like give you more potions, or stronger potions, was nice and I wish they can think of more "oh, cool!" rewards (something GoT did well, as they were usually glamour or actual things you'd be using for important value that was pretty obvious- unlike say FFXVI which is like "we gave you crafting material!! you wont know it but it will be helpful / IF / you decide to go new game +).

*(that are not really 'clever', that doesn't mean 'bad', just.. say a GoW linear map unfurls itself in puzzles, /fun/ backtracks, and overlaying, vs like a corridor you run down that is very pretty with some fights in it.. like we talked about in some DMC games)


Ultimately I wouldn't agree that I want zones like FFXVI if we are talking gameplay, because I didn't particularly think they were very interesting in terms of gameplay level design, but if you meant visually then yeah well I think the game is very pretty and that includes how they showed the world. World is purty, the level design allows the world to look purty, which is a good thing that doesn't just 'happen', buuuuuuuuuuuut the reward structures and interactions mechanically, gameplay wise, were lacking (imo). Which ranges from rewards, to just how you have to navigate the space mentally (as a puzzle), to the sheer movement itself (like a few times I was looking at a 2 ft barrier that made me go 100 ft in another direction cause my chocobo and bro-man couldn't jump, or swim, it).

I also think FFXIV could use improved exploration mechanics too though lol (and to your point FFXIV's dungeons are very pretty and are more similar to FFXVI's design style, they clearly know how to make a corridor exceptionally good looking). I have made posts on exploration ideas a few times.. and I have a promise to someone I need to fulfil to make a post on it.. Just got back into the states though (don't really like saying "I don't like something" without saying what I think would be examples of it doing better- lazily / real quick I'd mention GW2 but I'd hope to make a better post than that).

[RitsukoSonoda]

I disagree with this. The world of Eorzea is huge at this point and having to fly/walk everywhere would be a massive chore. Hell, even doing MSQ is a massive chore because you have to walk places. The blame for that lays squarely on how the zones are designed and the fact that there is hardly anything of interest in them. Just bunches of enemies who will aggro onto you if you get too close and...that's it. If you want me to travel through the world, give me something to do. A huge help would be allowing us to enable gathering node detection skills to be on without having to switch to the appropriate job. Walking from point A to point B would feel a lot less like a waste of time if you could gather something useful along the way. I know they tried to make dynamic events with FATEs, but they, for the most part, failed miserably. At least the older ones have fun lore tidbits you can discover (like that girl whose boyfriends get eaten by sand worms so often she doesn't even bother remembering her names anymore), I guess.

Besides, if you made people walk/fly everywhere, the only thing that would happen is people would take the shortest possible route. They wouldn't explore the zones anyway. If you want your players to be doing exploration, you have to give them incentive. Looking at other open-world games, this is usually achieved through stuff like collectibles or achievements. RIFT encouraged you to go to weird nooks and crannies because you could get artifacts. Genshin Impact hides chests with loot all over the place and has something you can gather scattered all over every zone. These two aren't really an option for XIV unless they are willing to make a major overhaul, unfortunately. What they could do are achievements. Climb the highest mountain, visit all the hidden caves, etc. But then I guess they would have to update the achievement vendor first.

Empty world design is a result of the over abundance of fast travel. It's far easier to get away with when very few people actually explore or travel around areas to see it. The initial ideas and incentives didn't work out the way they hoped and it was decided no more effort was needed because people just teleport everywhere and only stick around in most zones long enough to connect the quest marker dots.