XVI and XIV implications

[RitsukoSonoda]

I actually had the opposite opinion. I thought CBU3 was better at making MMOs than single player games. Not saying FFXIV is great, but between the two I would rather play FFXIV than FFXVI. Considering 16 has a lot of elements from FFXIV, it reinforced my opinion that it doesn't work for a single player game. Linear dungeons was one thing for an MMO, but for a single player too? That draws a line for me.

IMO FF16 has given me the opinion that CBU3 is better suited to making games that aren't RPGs as both this title and 16 are missing nearly everything expected of a title in the RPG genre. At the same time it could also mean that CBU3 isn't making the games they want to and instead are making the games that financial investors that have never played a game in their life say will make the most immediate profit.

[Jeeqbit]

IMO FF16 has given me the opinion that CBU3 is better suited to making games that aren't RPGs as both this title and 16 are missing nearly everything expected of a title in the RPG genre. At the same time it could also mean that CBU3 isn't making the games they want to and instead are making the games that financial investors that have never played a game in their life say will make the most immediate profit.

I think they are just using their experience of what people complain about. For example, people complained about having to travel everywhere on foot in FFXIV 1.0, so all the way in XVI they seem to have kept this lesson in their hearts and allowed you to teleport everywhere, taking away from the standard RPG experience of having to journey around on foot.

[RitsukoSonoda]

I think they are just using their experience of what people complain about. For example, people complained about having to travel everywhere on foot in FFXIV 1.0, so all the way in XVI they seem to have kept this lesson in their hearts and allowed you to teleport everywhere, taking away from the standard RPG experience of having to journey around on foot.

Abundance of fast travel points IMO is one of those things claimed to be a QoL improvement that really was just an appeasement for lazy gamers that chose to spend more time whining about it than just playing the actual game. It also essentially invalidates the effort in crafting the world since they're also making it so people don't see 90% of it because they're just bamf'ing all over the place like they're Nightcrawler. Having randomly interactable NPCs has also become pointless because they auto mark every quest NPC on the map for you even if you haven't gotten to that area to reveal the map yet and then auto mark every quest destination for you removing any need to actually pay attention to quest dialogue or details.

However it goes far beyond that to large amounts of literal game mechanics being removed like element factors, physical vs magical resistance, status effects, buffs/debuffs, equipment diversity and options, etc... For FF14 it's basically devolved to make numbers bigger while playing DDR with your fingers and pressing skill keys in a specific order. For FF16 it's essentially timing dodge key presses while hitting attack buttons when not dodging. What abilities you use don't matter mechanically because everything has the same effect on anything so it just boils down to which ones you like using.

[PercibelTheren]

Abundance of fast travel points IMO is one of those things claimed to be a QoL improvement that really was just an appeasement for lazy gamers that chose to spend more time whining about it than just playing the actual game. It also essentially invalidates the effort in crafting the world since they're also making it so people don't see 90% of it because they're just bamf'ing all over the place like they're Nightcrawler.

I disagree with this. The world of Eorzea is huge at this point and having to fly/walk everywhere would be a massive chore. Hell, even doing MSQ is a massive chore because you have to walk places. The blame for that lays squarely on how the zones are designed and the fact that there is hardly anything of interest in them. Just bunches of enemies who will aggro onto you if you get too close and...that's it. If you want me to travel through the world, give me something to do. A huge help would be allowing us to enable gathering node detection skills to be on without having to switch to the appropriate job. Walking from point A to point B would feel a lot less like a waste of time if you could gather something useful along the way. I know they tried to make dynamic events with FATEs, but they, for the most part, failed miserably. At least the older ones have fun lore tidbits you can discover (like that girl whose boyfriends get eaten by sand worms so often she doesn't even bother remembering her names anymore), I guess.

Besides, if you made people walk/fly everywhere, the only thing that would happen is people would take the shortest possible route. They wouldn't explore the zones anyway. If you want your players to be doing exploration, you have to give them incentive. Looking at other open-world games, this is usually achieved through stuff like collectibles or achievements. RIFT encouraged you to go to weird nooks and crannies because you could get artifacts. Genshin Impact hides chests with loot all over the place and has something you can gather scattered all over every zone. These two aren't really an option for XIV unless they are willing to make a major overhaul, unfortunately. What they could do are achievements. Climb the highest mountain, visit all the hidden caves, etc. But then I guess they would have to update the achievement vendor first.

[RitsukoSonoda]

I disagree with this. The world of Eorzea is huge at this point and having to fly/walk everywhere would be a massive chore. Hell, even doing MSQ is a massive chore because you have to walk places. The blame for that lays squarely on how the zones are designed and the fact that there is hardly anything of interest in them. Just bunches of enemies who will aggro onto you if you get too close and...that's it. If you want me to travel through the world, give me something to do. A huge help would be allowing us to enable gathering node detection skills to be on without having to switch to the appropriate job. Walking from point A to point B would feel a lot less like a waste of time if you could gather something useful along the way. I know they tried to make dynamic events with FATEs, but they, for the most part, failed miserably. At least the older ones have fun lore tidbits you can discover (like that girl whose boyfriends get eaten by sand worms so often she doesn't even bother remembering her names anymore), I guess.

Besides, if you made people walk/fly everywhere, the only thing that would happen is people would take the shortest possible route. They wouldn't explore the zones anyway. If you want your players to be doing exploration, you have to give them incentive. Looking at other open-world games, this is usually achieved through stuff like collectibles or achievements. RIFT encouraged you to go to weird nooks and crannies because you could get artifacts. Genshin Impact hides chests with loot all over the place and has something you can gather scattered all over every zone. These two aren't really an option for XIV unless they are willing to make a major overhaul, unfortunately. What they could do are achievements. Climb the highest mountain, visit all the hidden caves, etc. But then I guess they would have to update the achievement vendor first.

Empty world design is a result of the over abundance of fast travel. It's far easier to get away with when very few people actually explore or travel around areas to see it. The initial ideas and incentives didn't work out the way they hoped and it was decided no more effort was needed because people just teleport everywhere and only stick around in most zones long enough to connect the quest marker dots.

[Ath192]

Empty world design is a result of the over abundance of fast travel. It's far easier to get away with when very few people actually explore or travel around areas to see it. The initial ideas and incentives didn't work out the way they hoped and it was decided no more effort was needed because people just teleport everywhere and only stick around in most zones long enough to connect the quest marker dots.

100% agree. Fast travel is the reason the game is so barren and design is so poor. Everyone does it so no need to put effort. This is like cities designed for cars in America, they barren and unwalkable because everyone drives everywhere. The consequence is there are very few places to see.

[CStrife912]

100% agree. Fast travel is the reason the game is so barren and design is so poor. Everyone does it so no need to put effort. This is like cities designed for cars in America, they barren and unwalkable because everyone drives everywhere. The consequence is there are very few places to see.

Part of me wonders if they didn't do fast travel newer players would be turned off or people wanting to play it and not fancy doing the wow method of flight paths etc. We have to in some way understand the old style of play isn't as popular anymore and that's because the times have changed and gaming has changed. Most people that like the old systems are likely early to late 30s or in the 40s. We are a diminishing player group and games must try and foster new interest, that doesn't mean they couldn't compromise a middle ground because I agree the world needs it, they craft these spaces and as soon as you've done the 'story' of that area and your aetherial wind spots then the rest of your time spent there is purely an aerial view...unless your hunt training which even then is stop and go. 16 proves they can craft super detailed landscapes that are very pretty (not going into linearity here just the visual storytelling of the map) I hope with the graphics update and with 7.0 they design areas that make people want to explore and they improve on systems like FATEs and treasure maps to get people to want to spend more time in them. Only gatherers spend the most time in it and that's laughable if you think about it.

[MoofiaBossVal]

Besides, if you made people walk/fly everywhere, the only thing that would happen is people would take the shortest possible route. They wouldn't explore the zones anyway.

In Final Fantasy XI, you might be running through a zone to your destination when you see (or hear about in shout chat) some powerful rare mob or notorious monster spawning, so you would detour to go fight him. There you would join a party, and after the mob died you might wind up helping some players out with whatever task they were pursuing.

[Shinkuno]

In Final Fantasy XI, you might be running through a zone to your destination when you see (or hear about in shout chat) some powerful rare mob or notorious monster spawning, so you would detour to go fight him. There you would join a party, and after the mob died you might wind up helping some players out with whatever task they were pursuing.

Or in WoW: you take a flight point, see a random treasure pop on your minimap so when you land you get on your mount and go there. Then you see a rare spawn while questing and go do that. Or you see a cave on the map and you go explore it because there may or may not be a secret in there. FF14 players are too used to static dumbed down gameplay i guess to ever imagine that. Its clear that most people that defend this game at this point just want to watch a TV Show without looking like a "lazy person that just sits on their couch watching tv all day" so they pretend there is any gameplay left in this "game".