DPS should be WAR > GNB > DRK > PLD

[Cabalabob]

DRK is traditionally a solid tank: FF3 and FF4. It wasn't until later FFs they tried to relabel it as a DPS. In original FF3 and NA FF4, they didn't even have HP draining abilities but it still makes sense as a tank who is meant to receive most of the heals.

PLD has always embodied the high defense and healing/utility tank. FF1, FF3, FF4, FF5, FF9.
WAR has usually been high DPS low defense frontline. Berserker in FF5 comes the closest to it.
GNB is more of a modern invention with Squall, who's very well rounded and high damage/VIT. So makes sense GNB would be behind WAR and above DRK/PLD.

This is exactly my point, your ideas of what the jobs should be differ from someone else’s. Ask anyone what a DRK is, do you think they’re going to tell you it’s a tank that uses white magic basically just an upgrade to the knight class? Because that’s what it was in the original ff3? No, they’re going to tell you it’s a dps that wears heavy armour and sacrifices health to deal damage, possibly having some black magic like drain spells mixed in.

WAR in ff1 and ff3 was just a fighter that could use most melee weapons, in fact if you’re talking in that most literal sense, WAR should be weaker than PLD AND DRK since knight (knight and paladin being one and the same in the ff series) and DRK in ff1 and 3 were simply direct upgrades to the WAR.

FF3 and 4 remakes remedied this by giving jobs more iconic moves, the warrior and knight were differentiated by WAR having advance, allowing it to do full damage from the backline while only taking normal damage, or do extra damage from the frontline for extra damage taken. Meanwhile knight got the defend command to decrease damage taken further. But if you’re going to take a revisionist view of this version of WAR and PLD you can’t also ignore that they made DRK into it’s more iconic form there too.

[Mithron]

As someone who played XI, I was unhappy with 14's DRK at first and how they made it into a tank even though I loved tanking in 14, but when I gave it a fair shot I found I loved it more as a tank and really enjoyed it. In the end, it doesn't matter what our perception is, the devs have intended 14 DRK to be a tank and it will always be that way, so they gave RPR for the "DPS DRK" fans which was really cool.

The most iconic DRK we have in FF is Cecil and no matter how you cut it, he is the designated tank of the party the entire game, especially as a DRK. And I do miss Delirium lowering INT and Rage of Halone lowering STR.

[dspguy]

Given how similar these jobs actually play...

GNB = DRK = WAR = PLD.

The weapon is just glam at this point. Pick what you want to wield and hack and slash with similar rotations/mitigation.

[Rithy255]

Given how similar these jobs actually play...

GNB = DRK = WAR = PLD.

The weapon is just glam at this point. Pick what you want to wield and hack and slash with similar rotations/mitigation.

yeah but I don't think most people want that.
I do think damage differences shouldn't be that much we're talking about 1-2% at max here.

Personally I want meaningful differences Such Jobs as Tanks/healers should express this in their healing/defensive/utility kits, I rather have a Tank feel different but less "viable" then other tanks then be a reskin that practically plays the same.

Realistically 7.0 is either going to double down on EW design or it's going to shift away from it, all I can hope is for the game to be more experimental with how they balance jobs instead of safe and uninteresting.

[Cabalabob]

As someone who played XI, I was unhappy with 14's DRK at first and how they made it into a tank even though I loved tanking in 14, but when I gave it a fair shot I found I loved it more as a tank and really enjoyed it. In the end, it doesn't matter what our perception is, the devs have intended 14 DRK to be a tank and it will always be that way, so they gave RPR for the "DPS DRK" fans which was really cool.

The most iconic DRK we have in FF is Cecil and no matter how you cut it, he is the designated tank of the party the entire game, especially as a DRK. And I do miss Delirium lowering INT and Rage of Halone lowering STR.

If we’re talking FFXI, once again, WAR was a basic job that was the middle ground having both berserk and defender to give up defence for attack and vice versa. DRK and PLD were then advanced jobs that leaned into one aspect of the WAR, DRK being an attacker that gave up mostly on defence, PLD being a defender that gave up mostly on attack.

DRK doesn’t have to be a dps to live up to that class fantasy. Even in ffxiv we can see that same pattern, DRK’s rotation is practically just WARs rotation but with extra attack buttons but less utility. A WAR that has given up on defence for more attack.

And Cecil isn’t really a good benchmark for anything because by that logic PLD should be stronger than DRK as it was his direct class upgrade and was better than it in every way even in the remake.

[Arohk]

GNB should do the most dps, because it uses a Gun.

[dspguy]

yeah but I don't think most people want that.
I do think damage differences shouldn't be that much we're talking about 1-2% at max here.

Personally I want meaningful differences Such Jobs as Tanks/healers should express this in their healing/defensive/utility kits, I rather have a Tank feel different but less "viable" then other tanks then be a reskin that practically plays the same.

Realistically 7.0 is either going to double down on EW design or it's going to shift away from it, all I can hope is for the game to be more experimental with how they balance jobs instead of safe and uninteresting.

I'm not saying it should be like that. I'm saying that's how it is. Given that the toolsets are so similar, they might as well just remove the 4 jobs, replace it with just a single "tank role job" and let you pick your weapon.

[Oizen]

GNB should do the most dps, because it uses a Gun.

Yeah but only once, since they broke the gun

[GoatOfWar]

And utility should be PLD > DRK > GNB > WAR as a result to fulfill proper class fantasy.

Change my mind.

War should be botom 2. It already has so much else going.

[Mithron]

War should be botom 2. It already has so much else going.

Then remove it and make it #1 and give its else to PLD and DRK instead.