DEVs Stop adding worthless pointless gear to dungeon chests.

[Exni]

Stick to speaking for yourself. There are plenty of people who also are against gear swapping. The numbers aren't overwhelming in either regard.

Also, jobs even moreso than classes specialize in what they bring to a party. You don't need to be great at everything. You need to be great at what you're meant to do and good at other things. The party as a whole should cover everything.

It's like BRDs that wear harnesses with crit attack power and switch to AF for ballad and back for the rest. Being able to do things like this only serves to promote such behavior as it arguably makes you more effective at DPS, which is secondary to your role as support. It makes it a standard. The truth remains that there are other jobs that have DPS as their primary role.

All gear-swapping does is create an expectancy for every player to do more than what they're meant to do on their job. Promote it and then you'll have scores of people saying "Oh look at that BRD he only uses AF and doesn't switch to this or that while not singing."

Yeah guy, that's why you'll notice I never said that there wasn't abunch of people against it. You'll also notice that I never claimed that either side had an overwhelming majority.. But thanks for the "filler" info.. I guess..

I'm not following your statement about "you don't need to be great at everything..". Not sure what that has to do with gear swaps. Gear swaps don't all of a sudden break you out of your role in the party... I'm sorry but I don't think anyone was talking about gear swapping a whm into a tank.. Nice try tho. As I already said, gear swaps just allow you to further customize your role, whatever that may be. If your DPS, through gear swaps during the encounter you may want to be more careful on enmity changes and swap in some -enmity gear, or you may be using abunch of multi-hit WS and want to swap in some crit+, or your about to use some ability (ie. Convert) and want to shorten the CD so you swap in your AF.. That is the concept of gear swapping.

To be fair, I'm not sure where your even coming from most of the time which is why I didn't bother to focus much on your other posts. Your entitled to your opinion as I am am mine, but I figured what was the point if I didn't even understand the point you were trying to make? Plus other people seemed to understand and some agree with your thoughts, so I figured I'd leave it at that.

[Jinko]

Can you honestly say this doesn't happen in MMOs without gear-swap? Like be real, can you say you've never, ever seen people expect you to have certain gear or even certain tiers of gear for x reason? i.e Gold gear in Tera?

I would rather be able to tell someone competence by looking at what materia they have inserted in their gear than the actual gear they are wearing.

In WoW I could tell a bad player from a good one regardless of the gear they wore because of the enchantments and gems they had in their gear, anyone can join a pug group and get lucky with a nice piece of gear (Ifrit anyone ?) but seeing what materia a person has in their gear shows you if they know their class IMO.

I like the idea behind materia but limiting it to white items makes it total BS imo, not that I ever want to see multi melded blues either.

As Noctis said before the idea of upgrading AF or U/U items is much more appealing.

[Elexia]

As Noctis said before the idea of upgrading AF or U/U items is much more appealing.

It is, that's why I adore the Magian system in FFXI. It only goes to +2 but hell the boosts are great >.>

[NoctisUmbra]

Yeah guy, that's why you'll notice I never said that there wasn't abunch of people against it. You'll also notice that I never claimed that either side had an overwhelming majority.. But thanks for the "filler" info.. I guess..

I'm not following your statement about "you don't need to be great at everything..". Not sure what that has to do with gear swaps. Gear swaps don't all of a sudden break you out of your role in the party... I'm sorry but I don't think anyone was talking about gear swapping a whm into a tank.. Nice try tho. As I already said, gear swaps just allow you to further customize your role, whatever that may be. If your DPS, through gear swaps during the encounter you may want to be more careful on enmity changes and swap in some -enmity gear, or you may be using abunch of multi-hit WS and want to swap in some crit+, or your about to use some ability (ie. Convert) and want to shorten the CD so you swap in your AF.. That is the concept of gear swapping.

To be fair, I'm not sure where your even coming from most of the time which is why I didn't bother to focus much on your other posts. Your entitled to your opinion as I am am mine, but I figured what was the point if I didn't even understand the point you were trying to make? Plus other people seemed to understand and some agree with your thoughts, so I figured I'd leave it at that.

My initial mentioning of people also being against it and that there's no overwhelming majority either way to speak of was more of a statement to put out there to balance your saying there are other people in XIV who will advocate it. Not so much as warning you of anything really. The only thing in that paragraph I'd say was directed to you is the speak for yourself bit. It's a good rule of thumb in general.

As for your not understanding my points, I apologize. Perhaps I can attempt to clarify a bit, although I felt my examples with BRD were sufficient. In response to your bit about a WHM suddenly being a tank via gear-swapping- although ironic that there were people who claimed it to be possible or even advocated for it to be viable on these forums- is not such an extreme example that I was shooting for.

Granting the ability to have multiple sets for use on the fly is tantamount to having them all. I don't see this as customization, rather I see it as the lack thereof. A means to brute-force your character to effectively perform potentially everything there is gear with a bonus for.

Through customization, one can tailor build a set for themselves to prioritize what they wish to focus on in a party. They can custom-build gear pieces with materia for this purpose. They can even have multiple gear sets that prioritize different focuses of the job/class they are for. Then they can pick and use a set for a given battle based on what is needed. Plenty of customization there. Swapping between pieces of these sets mid battle provides players with the means to no longer need to tailor make gear sets, but rather only make gear pieces and then swap among the best ones for each given skill/purpose. It takes the strategy out of the fight, and relocates it into the tailoring of gear and macros.

I hope that clarifies my stance against gear-swapping.

[Molly_Millions]

Granting the ability to have multiple sets for use on the fly is tantamount to having them all. I don't see this as customization, rather I see it as the lack thereof. A means to brute-force your character to effectively perform potentially everything there is gear with a bonus for.

This is what I was trying to get at as well. If there are 5 'best' pieces for a given slot/class that we need for various skills, with gear swapping, everyone who plays that class will be expected to have them or be sub-par. Ultimately, we'll all be after the same gear, where is the uniqueness in that? I'd rather have multiple pieces of gear available and be able to customize their stats.

[NoctisUmbra]

This is what I was trying to get at as well. If there are 5 'best' pieces for a given slot/class that we need for various skills, with gear swapping, everyone who plays that class will be expected to have them or be sub-par. Ultimately, we'll all be after the same gear, where is the uniqueness in that? I'd rather have multiple pieces of gear available and be able to customize their stats.

There may end up being best gears in slot. That will especially be the case without gear-swaps. However so long as there are multiple comparable gear it shouldn't lead to a sever issue as being kicked for not having THE best gear. With the materia system we already have this.

My underlying point is each player doesn't have to be the best at everything they can do via using all of their gear sets each fight, but really good at their primary focus by choosing their custom set that enhances that focus for the given party.

[Rydin]

Oh God... this has become a full on Gear swap thread...
time to unsubscribe

[Exni]

My initial mentioning of people also being against it and that there's no overwhelming majority either way to speak of was more of a statement to put out there to balance your saying there are other people in XIV who will advocate it. Not so much as warning you of anything really. The only thing in that paragraph I'd say was directed to you is the speak for yourself bit. It's a good rule of thumb in general.

As for your not understanding my points, I apologize. Perhaps I can attempt to clarify a bit, although I felt my examples with BRD were sufficient. In response to your bit about a WHM suddenly being a tank via gear-swapping- although ironic that there were people who claimed it to be possible or even advocated for it to be viable on these forums- is not such an extreme example that I was shooting for.

Granting the ability to have multiple sets for use on the fly is tantamount to having them all. I don't see this as customization, rather I see it as the lack thereof. A means to brute-force your character to effectively perform potentially everything there is gear with a bonus for.

Through customization, one can tailor build a set for themselves to prioritize what they wish to focus on in a party. They can custom-build gear pieces with materia for this purpose. They can even have multiple gear sets that prioritize different focuses of the job/class they are for. Then they can pick and use a set for a given battle based on what is needed. Plenty of customization there. Swapping between pieces of these sets mid battle provides players with the means to no longer need to tailor make gear sets, but rather only make gear pieces and then swap among the best ones for each given skill/purpose. It takes the strategy out of the fight, and relocates it into the tailoring of gear and macros.

I hope that clarifies my stance against gear-swapping.

Yeah see there must be some fundamental difference we have in the issue, because I see (and have tried to explain) how gear swaps directly add more customization by providing more options of what's viable. You see it doing the opposite. I see gear swapping adding a TREMENDOUS amount of strategy and complexity (as I've said the current system is abit boring) to the encounter because SE knows your not limited to whatever you were[ wearing. Since you'd be capable of adapting to different situations better, they could effectively mix up the dynamics of the encounter that much more. While you see gear swapping as just abunch of unnecessary macro's that could somehow (I still don't get that part) promote elitism more than the current system.

Just two completely different trains of thought. I just don't like that your train of thought has to exclude what others would find enjoyable. It shouldn't be a personal affront to you if gear swapping is included. You like to use the arguement that people might complain if your not gear swapping... Yo people gonna complain about everything at some point (have you played mmos lately lol ).. If you'd rather not gear swap all the time (or at all) then don't, play the game how you want to. But this whole 'i don't want to be bothered with needing to gear swap, and I don't want to see anybody ask me to gear swap, so I don't want anyone to be able to gear swap because basically i just don't feel like it' mentality is... kinda lame.

[NoctisUmbra]

Yeah see there must be some fundamental difference we have in the issue, because I see (and have tried to explain) how gear swaps directly add more customization by providing more options of what's viable. You see it doing the opposite. I see gear swapping adding a TREMENDOUS amount of strategy and complexity (as I've said the current system is abit boring) to the encounter because SE knows your not limited to whatever you were[ wearing. Since you'd be capable of adapting to different situations better, they could effectively mix up the dynamics of the encounter that much more. While you see gear swapping as just abunch of unnecessary macro's that could somehow (I still don't get that part) promote elitism more than the current system.

Just two completely different trains of thought. I just don't like that your train of thought has to exclude what others would find enjoyable. It shouldn't be a personal affront to you if gear swapping is included. You like to use the arguement that people might complain if your not gear swapping... Yo people gonna complain about everything at some point (have you played mmos lately lol ).. If you'd rather not gear swap all the time (or at all) then don't, play the game how you want to. But this whole 'i don't want to be bothered with needing to gear swap, and I don't want to see anybody ask me to gear swap, so I don't want anyone to be able to gear swap because basically i just don't feel like it' mentality is... kinda lame.

Sorry man, I just don't see how it adds customization. Perhaps strategy yes. I didn't argue it didn't have a strategic element to it. I did however argue that it takes the strategy away from the encounter and relocates it to the production of effective macros and different gear pieces with single purposes.

You see, on one hand you say that it won't be an affront to me as I don't necessarily have to gear swap if it's made viable, but if it isn't viable people who want to can't. Before that however, you mention how SE can design content based on the use of gear-swaps, thus promoting it officially. Contradiction right there. Massive one.

I'm not against customization. I'm not against giving more gear more use. I'm against gear-swapping. More gear can be made viable without resorting to gear-swapping, which is again lazy design. Considering the devs have in the stated their stance being against gear-swapping, I like to think they also feel like they can come up with something better.

[Exn]

You see, on one hand you say that it won't be an affront to me as I don't necessarily have to gear swap if it's made viable, but if it isn't viable people who want to can't. Before that however, you mention how SE can design content based on the use of gear-swaps, thus promoting it officially. Contradiction right there. Massive one.

How? I said you play how you want to play the game. If you want to enter an encounter and gear swap, then do so. If not, then don't. Just because the content has been tailored to account for players potentially gear swapping doesn't mean you'd have to.. If you didn't want that extra dps, hmp, or whatever you coulda got from gear swapping then that's your choice. Maybe you didn't even need to gear swap because you got that darklight or <insertnamehere> set and are already performing your role more than adequately for the encounter. Meanwhile, your linkshell mate hasn't been lucky enough to acquire that pimp set yet and can't keep up with you unless he gear swaps in some extra crit+ for his WS's, and some AF to enhance his self-buffs (also help keeping AF viable in the long run), making much more currently unused gear in this game, useful. You can even choose to not gear swap while not having 'great' gear either, by simply relying less on gear.. and more on skill and focus to survive the encounter. I didn't contradict myself.

I understand that you are against gear swapping. I agree that more gear can be made viable other ways. That being the real issue, I hope the Dev's start implementing ways to do that soon, not excluding gear swaps for those that are interested.