Inconsistencies with the sundering (Spoilers)

[kpxmanifesto]

Look, people want to defend this cutscene by saying its not a retcon because it's just a metaphor. Show me what part of this cutscene accurately portrays, literally or metaphorically, the events of the sundering from shadowbringers.

What is the metaphor for etheirys being restored to its habitable state? What is the metaphor for the major battle between hydaelyn and zodiark that sunders etheirys?

I don't think there is. I could say that Venat holding her sword out in front of the other ancients who were praying to Zodiark is the metaphor for Hydaelyn's great battle with Zodiark but I would be really reaching.

[MikkoAkure]

Look, people want to defend this cutscene by saying its not a retcon because it's just a metaphor. Show me what part of this cutscene accurately portrays, literally or metaphorically, the events of the sundering from shadowbringers.

What is the metaphor for etheirys being restored to its habitable state? What is the metaphor for the major battle between hydaelyn and zodiark that sunders etheirys?

It’s not meant to accurately portray the events of the Sundering as described in Shadowbringers.

This whole point of this scene wasn’t a 1-to-1 depiction of the actual events that happened, for better or worse. It was to describe the newly revealed additional motivation for the Sundering that only just became news to us. In the frame of what they wanted to show us, they could’ve had a longer cutscene that also included the actual Sundering and the events that preceded it after Zodiark, but they went at it this way instead for whatever reason.

Considering you’re the only one who seems to not get it, I would recommend playing the game instead of watching a friend stream or watching clips out of context. It might make more sense to you then.

[RobynDaBank]

It’s not meant to accurately portray the events of the Sundering as described in Shadowbringers.

This whole point of this scene wasn’t a 1-to-1 depiction of the actual events that happened, for better or worse. It was to describe the newly revealed additional motivation for the Sundering that only just became news to us. In the frame of what they wanted to show us, they could’ve had a longer cutscene that also included the actual Sundering and the events that preceded it after Zodiark, but they went at it this way instead for whatever reason.

Considering you’re the only one who seems to not get it, I would recommend playing the game instead of watching a friend stream or watching clips out of context. It might make more sense to you then.

He's too busy making the Lalafell wall in Limsa.

[Alleo]

Hermes designed a being that could reach the edge of the universe. The people from the source designed a ship that could reach the edge of the universe. Suddenly going to the edge of the universe is impossible? Also the scenario we're discussing includes a fan theory that involves a much more powerful zodiark. You're not keeping up with the discussion.

There's no need to shut down players examining the story with more granularity. If you can't handle that, this might not be the best thread for you to stick around in.

There is more to it than just traveling there. Remember that Ultima Thule did not exist as a visible space until Thancred sacrificed himself? Or that each single scion bascially needed to overpower the Meteions with their answers while nearly dieing?

So even if they reached her I doubt they would have been able to interact with her.

I am really not sure why some dont understand that her scene was not meant to show us how it exactly happened? We know that the second round of sacrifices restored the planet, yet when we see Venat and the group of ancients talk the city is still burning and in ruins and even one of the beasts is still flying around. That should really be enough of a hint that what its shown is not what truly is happening.

[Raven2014]

You just called me a gaslighter...

Yes I did, after you said people disagree with you are just making excuse. Before that I was having a normal convo with you. So next time if you don't want unpleasantly, don't start it yourself.

It’s not meant to accurately portray the events of the Sundering as described in Shadowbringers.

I would go as far as saying it's not meant to portray the events "at all". ShB gives a historical and chronicle account of the physical conflict, while this cutsceen illustrate the justification and ideal clash of that conflict, not a cinematic recreation of the chronicle account. The CS isn't meant to show "this is what happened", but a "why it happens" on an abstract level (exactly what a stage play is), and consistently answer the question Venat posed to herself in Elpis. We didn't travel back in time to see a grandeur and cooler version of what we already know from ShB, we went to find the reason behind them, and that's what we got.

This is like accusing the cutsceen fail at something it never tries to do. Or complaining why an apple doesn't taste like orange.

[SannaR]

I think some are realizing why I stopped replying to this thread let alone try to debate with the OP as it's useless to try and do so. Even if you explain everything while making sure you cross your T's and dot your I's the OP will ignore most of what you said while going yes but what about X? And if you try to say no that's not what the lore or the devs have said he just pushes back with the "I'm not ignoring what the story says... I just want to explore this theory" cause we all need another thread about that cutscene.

[Solarra]

I think EW was rushed. They had about a decade of story to wrap up and for some reason (I believe Yoshi was bored/wanted to move on) they decided to try and wrap up everything in one expansion.
I am almost past caring about the story at this point and not sure I want to commit to the next. I was very invested in the story, especially after ShB and watching EW jump the shark was a huge disappointment.
So many characters, places and plot-points just dumped so we could move on. And no, Uncle Emet's bucket-list didn't inspire me. His transformation from complex villain to tour-guide, just made me wonder what on earth had happened to my favourite character.

To get back that scene with Hydaelyn, scenes that are metaphorical are iirc something we haven't seen in previous expansions. I'm not sure I buy 'it's a metaphor' when it comes to that scene because even if it wasn't meant to be literal, I'm not sure that's the right word for it. Also, a metaphor only works if people understand that it is one. So the fact that people have to be told, means it wasn't well done.

If people enjoyed EW, great, good for them.
If people didn't enjoy it or found some aspects flawed and they want to discuss that, this forum should be the place to do that.
And if some people want to tie themselves in knots trying to explain away all the plot holes and inconsistencies, knock yourselves out.

As I said, I'm almost past caring at this point. I'm hoping the next expansion will be better but the poor writing in EW has been enough to make me very wary about committing to a pre-purchase.

[PeaTearGriffin]

I don't think there is. I could say that Venat holding her sword out in front of the other ancients who were praying to Zodiark is the metaphor for Hydaelyn's great battle with Zodiark but I would be really reaching.

It’s not meant to accurately portray the events of the Sundering as described in Shadowbringers.

Good, so you people understand that the game presents a retcon to us with this cutscene. A retcon is defined as: "a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events."

It's crazy the amount of mental gymnastics some of you guys are using just to avoid admitting that the story writers messed up by creating a retcon.

[Iyrnthota]

Good, so you people understand that the game presents a retcon to us with this cutscene. A retcon is defined as: "a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events."

It's crazy the amount of mental gymnastics some of you guys are using just to avoid admitting that the story writers messed up by creating a retcon.

That same definition could also be used to describe a "twist"

[PeaTearGriffin]

To get back that scene with Hydaelyn, scenes that are metaphorical are iirc something we haven't seen in previous expansions. I'm not sure I buy 'it's a metaphor' when it comes to that scene because even if it wasn't meant to be literal, I'm not sure that's the right word for it. Also, a metaphor only works if people understand that it is one. So the fact that people have to be told, means it wasn't well done.

That's exactly it. Plenty of people don't buy the excuse that it's just a metaphor. People keep saying its metaphorical or symbolic but where are these supposed metaphors and symbolism? That's why I keep thinking that the story writers are using this excuse as a cover up for inattentive writing. What metaphor was there for order being restored in etheirys and the major battle between zodiark and hydaelyn? The cutscene, even if it was a metaphor, presents a different interpretation to the player, aka a retcon.