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  1. #1
    Player
    Fendred's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    956
    Character
    Valentyne Laska
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Dancer Lv 100
    On the shield healer side, isn't this a pretty milk toast issue? The core of scholar's toolkit is a two-second hard cast shield while sage's core toolkit is a pure heal that transforms into an instant cast shield of the same potency. Sage can just mitigate a lot more stuff than scholar due to being faster, and at the same potency to boot. Its the same thing on the cooldown side of things. Either its cooldowns are linked to adloq/succor and thus are slower by relation or the cooldown requires extraneous input (ground targeting, summoning seraph to use seraphic veil, having to dismiss a status effect to get your fairy back, etc).

    People get bored of playing the same job all the time. When the only other option in a role is a downgrade, people are going to start playing another role.
    (0)
    Last edited by Fendred; 11-14-2022 at 07:24 AM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Join Date
    Oct 2021
    Posts
    959
    Quote Originally Posted by Fendred View Post
    On the shield healer side, isn't this a pretty milk toast issue? The core of scholar's toolkit is a two-second hard cast shield while sage's core toolkit is a pure heal that transforms into an instant cast shield of the same potency. Sage can just mitigate a lot more stuff than scholar due to being faster, and at the same potency to boot. Its the same thing on the cooldown side of things. Either its cooldowns are linked to adloq/succor and thus are slower by relation or the cooldown requires extraneous input (ground targeting, summoning seraph to use seraphic veil, having to dismiss a status effect to get your fairy back, etc).
    This isn't true at all, SCH is by far better at mitigation than SGE is, which is why SCH is overwhelmingly picked for DSR over SGE because DSR is a mitigation intensive encounter.
    (2)

  3. #3
    Player
    Atelier-Bagur's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Posts
    3,980
    Character
    Cordelia Emery
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 82
    Quote Originally Posted by Fendred View Post
    On the shield healer side, isn't this a pretty milk toast issue? The core of scholar's toolkit is a two-second hard cast shield while sage's core toolkit is a pure heal that transforms into an instant cast shield of the same potency. Sage can just mitigate a lot more stuff than scholar due to being faster, and at the same potency to boot. Its the same thing on the cooldown side of things. Either its cooldowns are linked to adloq/succor and thus are slower by relation or the cooldown requires extraneous input (ground targeting, summoning seraph to use seraphic veil, having to dismiss a status effect to get your fairy back, etc).

    People get bored of playing the same job all the time. When the only other option in a role is a downgrade, people are going to start playing another role.
    I mean, you say that but as somebody who enjoys playing Warrior or Paladin, I always switch to other roles or classes to avoid self-burnout.

    I cant ever understand people who limit themselves on having a "main" job on a game that gives you the freedom to switch your playstyle on the fly. Sounds like a very easy way to get bored or burn yourself out if you just stick to one or two classes.

    If healer gets boring, I switch to dps, if dps gets boring, I switch to tank, and if tank gets boring I switch back to healer. I dont ever try to stubbornly stay on one role or class in this game if I dont want to, and I find myself the happier with this game's combat when I switch up playstyles and roles often.
    (1)

  4. #4
    Player
    ASkellington's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Posts
    985
    Character
    Xynnel Valeroyant
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur View Post
    I cant ever understand people who limit themselves on having a "main" job on a game that gives you the freedom to switch your playstyle on the fly. Sounds like a very easy way to get bored or burn yourself out if you just stick to one or two classes.
    Welcome to how MMOs like WoW are played, where you have 1 class per character. I'll grant you, that in such cases there are talent trees to where you can switch you role (say from Heal/Tank to DPS) but to me there's little difference when fundementally I am playing one class (even if specs/trees play differently)

    Much like you can't understand people who limit themselves on one job I can't understand why (outside of flexing) people like to have multiple jobs. Its a difference of preference. I like having one job to get good at, other people like several.

    That said, that doesn't excuse the state of the healer role. "Self burnout" as you call it is a real thing yes, but self burnout is not the whole reason contributing to why people think healers currently suck.
    (10)
    I'm tired of being told to wait for post-patches and expansions for fixes and increased healing requirements that are never coming. Healers are not fun in all forms of content like all jobs should be, they're replaced by tanks and dps due to low healing requirements and their dps kit is small for 0 reason, when in the past we had more options and handled things just fine. I refuse to play healer in roulette come DT. I refuse to heal EXs, I refuse to go into Savage, and I am boycotting Ultimate.

    #FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

  5. #5
    Player
    Join Date
    Oct 2021
    Posts
    959
    Quote Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur View Post
    I mean, you say that but as somebody who enjoys playing Warrior or Paladin, I always switch to other roles or classes to avoid self-burnout.

    I cant ever understand people who limit themselves on having a "main" job on a game that gives you the freedom to switch your playstyle on the fly. Sounds like a very easy way to get bored or burn yourself out if you just stick to one or two classes.

    If healer gets boring, I switch to dps, if dps gets boring, I switch to tank, and if tank gets boring I switch back to healer. I dont ever try to stubbornly stay on one role or class in this game if I dont want to, and I find myself the happier with this game's combat when I switch up playstyles and roles often.
    Not really how Savage works. Gearing necessitates that you're locked into a role for at least 8 weeks, often way longer due to not everyone being week 1 clear material (nothing wrong with this) so often times you're stuck to your role for months a tier.
    Further more, healers do not play meaningfully different from each other for a majority of their casts. There's not a single healer that breaks the monotony of 1 DoT 1 Filler Nuke spam. There's no "playstyles" within the healer role. There's one enforced way to play, on all four jobs within the role.
    I get the point you're making, and I don't necessarily disagree with it (I don't do casual content on the jobs I raid on for the same reason) but at the same point, shouldn't "switching your playstyle on the fly" also apply within roles too, like it used to in the healer role?
    (10)

  6. #6
    Player
    HyperiusUltima's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    1,423
    Character
    Eileen White
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Nizzi View Post
    Not really how Savage works. Gearing necessitates that you're locked into a role for at least 8 weeks, often way longer due to not everyone being week 1 clear material (nothing wrong with this) so often times you're stuck to your role for months a tier.
    Further more, healers do not play meaningfully different from each other for a majority of their casts. There's not a single healer that breaks the monotony of 1 DoT 1 Filler Nuke spam. There's no "playstyles" within the healer role. There's one enforced way to play, on all four jobs within the role.
    I get the point you're making, and I don't necessarily disagree with it (I don't do casual content on the jobs I raid on for the same reason) but at the same point, shouldn't "switching your playstyle on the fly" also apply within roles too, like it used to in the healer role?
    To add onto this, the only difference between the healers is in HOW they treat the damage that happens to keep the party alive. SCH/SGE provide shields and abilities that reduce overall damage with hard mitigation. I can't relate WHM to AST as much because they rely more on GCD healing than most, and AST relies on their oGCDs to handle things. The playstyles I see are extremely similar between SGE/SCH, but slightly different between WHM and AST as AST has a high APM and WHM is slower than most in terms of APM.
    (2)