New Caster

[Kalaam]

I find a DoT centric job to be unlikely.
They didn't strip existing jobs of their DoTs to make room for another one, they did so because they're a pain to balance and because too many debuffs up at a time causes issues. Frankly I'm amazed BRD still has two DoTs, and wouldn't be surprised if it lost one in 7.0.

It's more likely than you think, they often removed a lot of mechanics of some jobs to put them into a new one.

[Seraphor]

It's more likely than you think, they often removed a lot of mechanics of some jobs to put them into a new one.

Like what?
I wouldn't say removing ASTs shields to make way for SGE counts...

[MagiusNecros]

First off regarding Blue Mage yes you can. It is a job class that participates in content all the way up to Stormblood and is prominent in soloing Treasure Map dungeons and it's primary skillset in it's burst is it's big DoT in Nightbloom and when it isn't using Nightbloom it is using a boosted Song of Torment in it's place. And if you feel you cannot count BLU you can take the time to explain why and you really can't because the point for it's inclusion is that it is a class that has DoTs to begin with. And most of them have their uses. Of all of them Aqua Breath is the weakest. Song of Toirment/Nightbloom are used frequently.

Secondly the point is if the devs don't want DoTs then why are they even there to begin with? A lot of these classes are still required to use these DoTs for max damage whether it's for sustain or under buffs for burst windows. The only DPS that doesn't really need to use their DoT is Ninja because outside of AoE it's garbage. And you can consider AQ and LS to not be DoTs but they pretty much are.

You still have 14 out of 20 classes that use DoTs as a damage source.

As far as balancing the 2 minute meta has to go. Between forcing a 2 minute meta and the stat squish the game that was very balanced in Shadowbringers is a unbalanced mess in Endwalker. And as long as they force a 2 minute meta all job classes have to play a certain way and because of this no job in PvE barring Blue Mage has any job identity whatsoever. And this fact alone is why PvP is taking off so well because no job in PvP plays the same. If each job had it's own kit and can use their own Limit Breaks it would be a fantastic experience.

However since the devs want to design PvE the way they are I'm gonna say in the name of BWALWANCE and HWOMWENMUHGEENIZATISHUN they should add a no nonsense no raid buff no utility caster on the same level as Black Mage and I don't care what it is.

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Regarding job mechanics they carted off to other jobs you have DRK giving everything in defensives to the other tanks and specifically giving Dark Dance to Gunbreaker, Sage received DRK's old Dark Arts mechanic for buffing certain abilities, Reaper got Dragoon's Heavy Thrust with added flair and it would not surprise me if they reskinned Kaiten or DoTs as another classes big feature. You can be blissfully unaware but it's still happening if you bother to look. But if you don't care that's fair.

[Seraphor]

Blue Mage doesn't count because it's not balanced in the same way as other jobs.
There are a myriad of rules for 'main' jobs that simply do not apply to BLU.

The burst phase isn't going anywhere I'm afraid. I agree the 2 minute window is getting too restrictive, but that's the direction we're going in.

And what's with all the sass?

[MagiusNecros]

Blue Mage doesn't count because it's not balanced in the same way as other jobs.
There are a myriad of rules for 'main' jobs that simply do not apply to BLU.

The burst phase isn't going anywhere I'm afraid. I agree the 2 minute window is getting too restrictive, but that's the direction we're going in.

And what's with all the sass?

Gonna have to elaborate more because BLU follows a bursty mode and then spams filler in most cases...like other jobs. Just cuz is a bad argument.

I'm a Galvus. Sass runs in the family.

Let's get back on topic pls. It might be worth hearing what kind of caster you would like and if you have any ideas now would be the time to share and by ideas I mean plausible job mechanics that you think would be fun and engaging to play.

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Also I want to take the time to say that Raikai I like your Mystic concept as it would introduce a Eastern job, has a unique weapon type and could delve into a plausible Beast Tribe culture or a culture that is based around Thavnair's Beast Gods. And I like the overall aesthetic as it has this horror vibe I could click with. And I've always been a fan of a Voodoo Doll weapon type. Lulu in FFX as far as design goes was a breath of fresh air.

A debuffer that makes their hardcasts more powerful would as mentioned before be an amazing mechanic to work around.

[SaberMaxwell]

They probably won't add a dot caster for the same reason dots have been reduced in the game since StB launch: there is a debuff cap on enemies that, once reached, they'll straight up start dodging status effects. Actually if you play WAR, have SGE, and both fc buffs up, you can reach that buff cap yourself in dsr phase 7 where you can dodge your own Bloodwhetting!

But yeah. Their design space regarding dots is hampered by server tech from the Jurassic period. That's probably why.

[MagiusNecros]

I highly doubt you are going to reach 48 debuffs on a single enemy outside of at best an Alliance raid.

[SaberMaxwell]

I do too. And yet here we are in a post HW world, where everyone has been losing more and more dots every expansion with the buff limit described as one of the key reasons.

Dream if you want, I'm not saying it CAN'T, just that its not likely.

[Renathras]

Whitebrim Massacre goes brr. Also Garleans see you as a monster, and you were a walking death machine in Shadowbringer.

Yeah, but defiling the dead is considered a particularly evil act, and I'm not 100% sure, but I feel like in Japan (where Shinto/ancestor worship is a thing and it's a high honor/shame based culture), there would be a REALLY strong aversion to raising and animating people's corpses to fight for you in battle. And if it isn't that (e.g. summoning voidsent - which is close to that but not exactly that), then it wouldn't be Necromancer anyway.

Green Mage in it's entries fits more IMO as a Tank given it's defensives and debuffing abilities which would be interesting although I can see Time Mage making for an amazing Magic Tank.

Maybe, but both are far more likely to be introduced as casters than tanks, I'd wager.

I feel like if they wanted to remove DoTs why keep them on:

Right, but do the math on this per raid team:

Healers: 2
Tanks: 2, with at least 1 being short duration (Circle of Scorn, Bow Shock), and WAR doesn't have even one.
Melee: 2 if you have a SAM and NIN who is inexplicably using his AOE rotation - Doton isn't a single target ability. Or DRG and MNK (you forgot Monk's, I think...Demolish?)
Ranged: MCH is the only one with one, and it's a short duration with a CD only used in AOE.
Casters: BLM and SMN each have 1, RDM has none.

BLU, as we all know, isn't allowed in general content.

And several of those aren't DoTs (debuff on the boss); Living Shadow and Automaton Queen are not, so they don't count towards the DoT stack/debuff limit.

So in practice, in a raid fight/8 man boss, you have 4-6 with +2 during Tank burst phases if you don't have a WAR Tank. And of all of those, only ONE is really central to the class in terms of something other than "don't let it fall off", which is BLM making use of Thundercloud procs. The rest are either a strict part of the rotation (e.g. PLD, SMN, etc) or are something used to refersh the DoT when it's about to expire (all healers)

If you have a DoT heavy roster, something like PLD/GNB/Healer1/Healer2/DRG/SAM/BRD/BLM, then you end up with 8 DoTs kept up all the time with +3 (I think it is) situational/short duration DoTs that come up here and then fall off. So the most DoT heavy standard party is 8 DoTs with short spikes up to 11.

And yeah, I have no idea why the Dev team makes things like Sonic Break while also saying they want to reduce DoTs. It makes zero sense to me other than flavor/aesthetic of wanting buttons that are "more interesting" than just "does direct damage" or something.

EDIT:

I highly doubt you are going to reach 48 debuffs on a single enemy outside of at best an Alliance raid.

Not that the game is balanced around them (but you're bringing up BLU and the game isn't balanced around it, either), but hop on a Hunt Train and you see this on every single boss.

A DoT-centric spellcaster would be expected to have AT LEAST 3 DoTs, and probably more like 5-6 if the entire theme and function of the Job is based around DoTs; 3 to maintain all the time and 2-4 short duration ones attached to CDs that line up during burst phases. Meaning during Burst, the boss might come pretty close to that cap, especially in 24 mans, and if you have more than one of this Job in the party/raid.

I'm with Saber on this one:

But yeah. Their design space regarding dots is hampered by server tech from the Jurassic period. That's probably why.

As much as they seem to LOVE slapping _A_ DoT on every Job and their grandma, they seem not to want to make Jobs with much more than that. BRD is the only current Job that seeks to maintain full uptime on 2 DoTs, and no other Job has more than 2 that it can apply, and generally with one of those being on a CD so it's not 100% uptime. I can't think of any Job besides BLU that breaks that rule.

[MagiusNecros]

I think to account for their problems considering their debuff cap is that you limit it to 2 DoTs and that they are just Healer strong DoTs.

The only time the debuff cap is reached is potentially an Alliance Raid, Fates, Eureka/Bozja/Zadnor or a full team of BLU's deciding that stacking Aqua/NB(SoT)/BB/MB?/Libra/Offguard(Peculiar Light) is their life's calling.

But overall I really only see classes having 2 maybe 3 DoT's at most.

But you know you really have an easy way to circumvent this problem with a new class where your Dot's are just placed AoEs. You might have to be a bit smarter but it could be fun to optimize. You can already do this with Doton, and Sage's LB in PvP.

And you used to be able to do it with DRK's Salted Earth.

So 2 Dot's and then attacks or abilities that placed a field(Like Salted Earth or Asylum) that inflicts DoT damage or an ability like Phantom Flurry/Flamethrower(MCH)/Relentless Rush could be implemented to overcome this shortcoming.

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Given your raid team math with debuffs you'll never reach the 48 debuff limit. So it becomes a nonissue. The issue the community largely seems to have is they only care about 15 second 2 minute burst windows. Which in that case during that window you put up your DoTs, use a skill that ends the DoTs dealing their full damage immediately and reapply before the raid buffs go off as it snapshots the buffed potency in that moment meaning more damage. Burst and sustain at the same time.