Fight Designs & Class Balancement - Why everything is wrong and favors Melee Fantasy

[Aikaal]

Using a melee combo to keep uptime will always be better than keeping it for bursts. BLM is on a similar boat with its resources.

True but you miss the whole point. a RDM full melee combo is 2990 potency out of 12.7s. 2990 Potency is very high. You could rep that with 5 normal GCDs yeah. Let's actually calc what 3 Verthunder III, 2 Verfire because let's be optimal and an acceleration was dropped there. 1800 potency in 12.4s.

0.3s second aside. Yeah, uptime is always better but every time a Red Mage is using a melee combo outside of a burst window for mobility and uptime, he losses 1190 potency in a burst window. Tell me, does this equal to the potency loss of losing a few positionals? No, hell no it doesn't. Red Mage is just terrible period. If you were also unaware, Red Mage also suffers the great triple Enshroud pot issue where if you can Triple Resolution under a pot window, you should. That's something I was doing in DSR and I had a triple resolution burst pot window and a double melee combo and my DPS was really high for a caster but I could never rival a melee DPS.

Red Mage and Black Mage suffers a lot more than any melee who lose positional over mobility. Because their mobility skills are all their burst. Summoner gets away with it because they are a Physical Ranged. Still, I still need to do a Bahamut > Ifrit follow up in a burst window for the Vents otherwise I become a threat to my party or I just lose uptime.

So why are we getting punished by having everyone get downtime when there's melee downtime? What's the compensation from being a caster/ranged physical? There is none of that. The game favors Melee DPS and the balance is just effectively broken. The reason more than half the clears on P8S right now are Summoners for casters is because they are the one that deal with those issues better. But even at 100% uptime on my Summoner. I still lose by 10% to a melee DPS.

Also as an edit; you should know since you actually just do 10% more DPS than your caster in your group. It's not like he's bad but your caster shouldn't be 10% behind. The reason nobody plays Warrior or Paladin is because they do 10% less DPS than Dark knights and Gunbreakers. *shockers* nobody play them. So if there's a chance to just perform better with 3 or 4 melees, it'll happen Because this is Melee Fantays XIV and we're playing Meleewalker.

[Aco505]

0.3s second aside. Yeah, uptime is always better but every time a Red Mage is using a melee combo outside of a burst window for mobility and uptime, he losses 1190 potency in a burst window. Tell me, does this equal to the potency loss of losing a few positionals? No, hell no it doesn't. Red Mage is just terrible period. If you were also unaware, Red Mage also suffers the great triple Enshroud pot issue where if you can Triple Resolution under a pot window, you should. That's something I was doing in DSR and I had a triple resolution burst pot window and a double melee combo and my DPS was really high for a caster but I could never rival a melee DPS.

Could you tell me where you got that 1.2k potency? Because if you mean that using 50 mana to move outside of Embolden (a 5% buff) is 1.2k potency, then it's hardly the case. Using the number you provide (2990), 5% of a melee combo (and you can't fit two entire melee combos into Embolden) is 149.5 potency. If you add 6 of these GCDs into Manafication's 5%, you get 306,48 potency.

Assuming you had 0 mana by the time a 2-min starts (but still got Manafication for an extra 50), the loss would be not having a 2nd combo ready during Embolden, which would net to less than 149.5 potency. I'm not sure where your numbers are coming from.

So I don't see how I'm "missing the point". RDM is the least mobile caster, yes, but uptime > all.

That the gap between DPS is too big right now is not even debatable. I think I've made this clear in my posts.

I don't agree with this, as a selfish DPS your DPS comes only from your own damage, as a buffer, it depends on your damage but also and more importantly from the way you are buffing people / how players will use your buffs.

It's the way of contributing to the raid DPS that change, but in the end, the result should be pretty much the same.

I didn't invent the terms, but that's how they work.

I think in a roundabout way he is trying to say that if BLM rDPS = RDM rDPS just as an example then BLM would actually be stronger because rDPS not only adds DPS contributions to the buffers but subtracts them from the buffee, so if BLM = RDM when RDM applies a buff then theoretically a party comprised of no buffers would be objectively stronger

So I think the best way to say it would be rDPS if buffing classes should equal aDPS of the selfish classes (aDPS on DPS still runs into devilment cards and left eye but is more accurate)

It's not roundabout. If you go to the nDPS charts, you'll see who is on top. Then switch to rDPS and you see how several jobs move. It's the way these metrics work.

[Supersnow845]

Could you tell me where you got that 1.2k potency? Because if you mean that using 50 mana to move outside of Embolden (a 5% buff) is 1.2k potency, then it's hardly the case. Using the number you provide (2990), 5% of a melee combo (and you can't fit two entire melee combos into Embolden) is 149.5 potency. If you add 6 of these GCDs into Manafication's 5%, you get 306,48 potency.

Assuming you had 0 mana by the time a 2-min starts (but still got Manafication for an extra 50), the loss would be not having a 2nd combo ready during Embolden, which would net to less than 149.5 potency. I'm not sure where your numbers are coming from.

So I don't see how I'm "missing the point". RDM is the least mobile caster, yes, but uptime > all.

That the gap between DPS is too big right now is not even debatable. I think I've made this clear in my posts.



I didn't invent the terms, but that's how they work.



It's not roundabout. If you go to the nDPS charts, you'll see who is on top. Then switch to rDPS and you see how several jobs move. It's the way these metrics work.

Sorry I meant if that was your meaning your original comment didn’t convey it very well because I struggled to understand what you meant by it and I understand the distinction between a n and r DPS