Delete Ninja from PvP

[Dreadz]

You're not being too truthful. The slow, the stun, the self heal, the self shield, AND all the ranged attacks save for the shuriken are all Mudras. You can only use 2 of them at any given time, and in most cases you're not touching the slow, the heal, or the shield. You're touching either the ice daggers or the stun, because it's more important to KILL your target quickly. Hell, I'd argue that all the other Mudras are downright useless for that exact reason in CC.

You can hold a Mudra for 10secs and it has a 15sec CD, so just cast huton or meisui the last second and you can engage fights with a 16k shield that comes with a combat sprint or 4k potency regen, or give the regen to a teammate. NIN also doesn't have to focus on explicitly getting kills, doton on the point is a complete nuisance and a ranged AoE 4k DoT softens enemies up quite a bit. Let's not forget their fast charging LB that instantly kills anyone below 50%, also acts a gap closer and has a safety net in case you mess up.

[RyuDragnier]

You can hold a Mudra for 10secs and it has a 15sec CD, so just cast huton or meisui the last second and you can engage fights with a 16k shield that comes with a combat sprint or 4k potency regen, or give the regen to a teammate. NIN also doesn't have to focus on explicitly getting kills, doton on the point is a complete nuisance and a ranged AoE 4k DoT softens enemies up quite a bit. Let's not forget their fast charging LB that instantly kills anyone below 50%, also acts a gap closer and has a safety net in case you mess up.

You're rarely going to find a lot of people on a point unless it's at the end of a match in overtime. It's also, IMO, a waste when that mudra could have gone to stunning somebody to allow your team to burn them down. In CC if you're not using your mudras to go for a kill, you're likely doing it wrong. Remember, a dead enemy is gone for around 15-20s (depending on distance from their spawn), which is long enough to turn the tide of battle in your favor. Whereas that Doton and Goka are not going to kill multiple enemies, and the time you're waiting for your mudras to return may have given them enough time to LB and turn the tide against your group.

As for the LB, it charges the same speed as the other melee DPS, but is weaker. Yes, it can 1-shot people under 50% health, but latency can and will mess you up here. If they heal before the move registers they went under 50%, it won't kill them and will do less damage than most of your attacks. If they kill you before the animation finishes, you will lose the LB and your target will live. If they stun/poly you in the middle of the LB, your animation won't go through and the target will live while you lose the LB. The LB has a lot of counters to it.

[Dreadz]

You're rarely going to find a lot of people on a point unless it's at the end of a match in overtime. It's also, IMO, a waste when that mudra could have gone to stunning somebody to allow your team to burn them down. In CC if you're not using your mudras to go for a kill, you're likely doing it wrong. Remember, a dead enemy is gone for around 15-20s (depending on distance from their spawn), which is long enough to turn the tide of battle in your favor. Whereas that Doton and Goka are not going to kill multiple enemies, and the time you're waiting for your mudras to return may have given them enough time to LB and turn the tide against your group.

As for the LB, it charges the same speed as the other melee DPS, but is weaker. Yes, it can 1-shot people under 50% health, but latency can and will mess you up here. If they heal before the move registers they went under 50%, it won't kill them and will do less damage than most of your attacks. If they kill you before the animation finishes, you will lose the LB and your target will live. If they stun/poly you in the middle of the LB, your animation won't go through and the target will live while you lose the LB. The LB has a lot of counters to it.

Don't get me wrong, I wasn't disagreeing with your initial point, I was just arguing against the claim that besides Raijuu and Hyosho, all the other ninjustu aren't worth using. They're situational sure, but using them well can be game savers, especially during overtime.

Regarding the LB, almost all of the problems you listed affect a ton of other job's LBs, I mean, you can die to MCH LB in the middle of DRG's LB. NIN's LB though, has a safety net, something no other LB has in the entire mode. So even if you get screwed over by the terrible tick rate, there's still a chance for you to recover AND the LB starts after the initial use, so can build LB while getting chain kills.

[AnnRam]

After investing enough time in this current PVP patch (Frontlines mostly) the Meisui +Huton combo needs to go completely its cancer, they enter in god mode and nothing will kill them, I saw Nins with barely any BH and they still get away even if they get locked in MNK LB twice and 4 people hitting them at the same time, the healing its too much that negates any burst damage.

Now Huton actually negates the Chain Saw 3% insta kill, if the NIN get hits while Huton its on CS only deals 32k damage (basically half of the nin HP) this not happen if MNK/Reaper have their defensive tools uptime.

[RyuDragnier]

Now Huton actually negates the Chain Saw 3% insta kill, if the NIN get hits while Huton its on CS only deals 32k damage (basically half of the nin HP) this not happen if MNK/Reaper have their defensive tools uptime.

GOOD, that 3% insta kill needs to go die in a fire. Nobody likes a RNG insta-death ability in PvP.

[Nikoto]

If Huton blocks the shitty 3% chainsaw then I think they should give everyone huton all the time.

[AlanJust]

This class is not balanced for any 1v1.

It's not a melee it's a ranged job.
The entire class needs to rebalanced and reworked as in the current form it should just be illegal and there needs to be a wall build between every non-ninja and ninja.
You should not be able to duel a ninja, you just should not win.

CC with ninja should just be 5 ninja's versus 5 ninja's.
it is not balanced, it's lb is broken, the movement speed they get is stupid.
The shields they get is stupid.
The dot they have is too strong as I said before it's not a ranged job it is supposed to be a melee, why does it have a dot in the first place.

I agree with everything you said.
I play Ninja in CC and I am too OP.
I can actually 1 shot people solo.
I am way too fast for my own good, I am so fast I can't even play the game myself as I hardly see where I'm going.
I only ever struggle against other Ninjas.
I actually won some matches with my eyes closed and while playing with me toes.
I am actually a ranged class, don't let anyone fool you.

I don't think Ninjas should be able to queue into CC at all.

Please forgive me whoever got KO'ed by me in CC.

[Bissonnettzi]

I hope they rework it into something more entertaining than a shuriken chucking 50% health executioner. Make it a big bursty ambusher or something i dunno

[Valence]

I would argue that NIN is pretty balanced where it is currently at. The LB generation is fine as well for what it does, given that it comes up roughly the same time as most other jobs. NIN's LB requires coordination to an extent, unlike LB's like MNK, which builds up incredibly fast, removes guard, animation locks the target, and has a high chance of immediately removing enemy players from group fights; a similar case is presented in MCH, where the LB doesn't build as fast but can remove a player immediately from a fight with certain combos, much like MNK. It is a ranged MNK. I'm not even going to start on the 3% rate of chainsaw insta-kill - rework this.

The MCH LB burst is stellar, but it's not a one press button instant death either. You need to do certain combinations of abilities and initiate a proper setup that is highly sensitive to 1) a timeframe (like DRG LB) and 2) doesn't go through guard and can be totally wasted (like DRG LB).

The biggest LB setup is also the most cumbersome to use, you need to do a full wildfire sequence ending on Drill/Anchor + LB. Like the standard WF burst, it takes an LOT of preparation to do, and it's ultra sensitive to anything the target might do: remove LoS, or just guard at the proper time (once WF is about to explode, not at the beginning).

The slightly smaller but still deadly LB burst is harder to counter because it requires only one preparation shot after WF application, but again, it still requires the target to stay in LoS for the LB / WF explosion, and is again, sensitive to guard.

Then you have lighter WF setups which are just A. Drill/Anchor immediately followed by LB, pretty hard to counter because usually the LB is already initiated when you guard and there is no wildfire as a big telegraph. Those can be deadly, but they also sacrifice a lot of potency and the target can often survive pretty well unless they're out of resources and already chipped on health.

Overall if the enemy MCH has their LB ready, it's like any other jobs with similarly threatening LBs, you just watch them closely on the enemy party list, the same way you'd watch a SAM. I've very rarely been baited by a full MCH LB burst due to Wildfire being a huge warning to immediately LoS or guard, but I can understand that in the heat of the moment for a melee for example, it's easier to miss.

Ninja on the other hand, just has to find somebody with 50% HP or less, and it's a free kill with a button. There is literally no effort behind it whatsoever, and it's not like it's extremely hard to drop somebody to half HP either, be it with a team effort during a full skirmish, or on your own when you can already do a double fucking stun with Raiju.

[Valence]

Sure there is. You can hit them with Drill when they are sub-20%, or AA when they are sub-25%, or your LB when they are sub-30%, or you LB + AA or Drill when they are sub 50%. Or if you are on AA you might be able to kill them if they are sub-60% if you AA+Saw+LB if, and only if they are too slow to use a Recup between the GCDs.

One thing is for sure. You are not going to 100-0 anyone, ever, unless they are afk.

Full MCH LB burst is close to 75k ish potency. This will kill almost anybody unless they manage to sneak a recuperate, guard, or have mitigation up (barriers, damage reductions, etc). I've oneshot so many people, including tanks, that it can be disgusting, but it's also not a free one button sequence, it requires a setup. But yeah, MCH is actually a nasty tank killer, when tanks are too confident or don't want to give up on contesting a point.