SGE was designed to be the "dpsing healer" but sadly failed at it.

[Nethereal]

Looking at savage / ultimate metrics is like only looking at the top 5% of anything.

Need data from dungeons and EX content to balance that out.

Endsinger EX:



Hydaelyn EX:



Zodiark EX:

Looks about right. No reason to play SCH when the extra shielding isn't required nor does it make it any easier.
Especially considering each of those fights have like 1 mechanic specifically designed for lily and panhaima to get 100% efficiency.

[Doragan]

sch clunky fairy delays

I'm not sure I've read this on the forum yet, but I thought it would be worth writing out. It's probably very obvious, but still.

The issue wasn't, and still isn't, that there is a delay when you press the button.

The issue is that when you press the button, the result isn't consistent at all. The "delay" is unreliable.

(This doesn't take into account latency or animation lock.)

Press Action -> Action is done.


That's how it works for any other action in the game (that isn't a pet action).

Unfortunately, that isn't how it works for pet actions.

Press Action -> undefined amount of time -> Action is done.

It can sometimes even be

Press Action -> undefined amount of time -> No action is done.

That's the problem. Despite how fast the actions are compared to Pre-EW, the fact remains is that you got an undefined amount of time between the moment you press the oGCD order and the moment when the pet starts doing anything. It can wildly vary. That is a huge problem for a healer, as it makes part of your kit unreliable. Yes, the heal will (eventually) arrive. But if you were relying on Fey Blessing to survive and the fairy was too busy doing nothing, you will die.
If the amount of time was defined and 100% respected, yes. You could even consider it for the skill ceiling. You would need to time your stuff very accurately, which could be awesome to play with. Though, the solution isn't to delete the fairy at all. You actually need to redo the pet's AI. It been 10 years at this point. You can do it.

Another issue for me is the fact that the fairy will still sometimes forget what order she was given. And because of the nature of the single use oGCD order, it is what it is. Single use. The pet bar ensured this wouldn't be a problem, ever. If the action wasn't done, you could click as much as you want and it wouldn't be burned.
Purposefully worsening the job's QoL is still, years after, appalling.

[Doragan]

To get back on topic though, frankly I don't know. Not only it was an obvious lie, but it plays just like the other healers. Kardia is probably the worst though, because it pushes players to experience the Glare spam as a gameplay mechanic. I think it deserves an actual rotation, just like the other healers, and it could be very enjoyable imo. Maybe a proper Ruin II equivalent would be nice.
But please. One button spam isn't fun. For anyone.

[Sebazy]

The issue is that when you press the button, the result isn't consistent at all. The "delay" is unreliable.

I suggested a big old rework of SCH years ago and this was one of the focuses of it. Looking back at it, I think it's aged disappointingly well TBH =(

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...-revamp-theory.

[Absurdity]

I still believe that pet AI unreliability wasn't too much of an issue before their "improvements" (more like a downgrade) to the pets in ShB.

When you were able to execute the fairy abilities completely independently of your own casts it didn't really matter how much of a delay the fairy had or even if it forgot to execute an action, you could press the skill at literally any point in time.

After their "improvements" you were suddenly restricted to your own oGCD windows or would have to simply clip your GCD, no more executing Fey Blessing in the middle of a Broil cast, which made consistent execution that much more important because your opportunities to use the skills without clipping were severely limited. On top of that it took control over Embrace away from you entirely, making it even more unreliable than it had previously been.

[Sorzai]

I was expecting Sage to be similar to disc priest in WoW. Sadly it's just a front, Sage is basically a simplified version of scholar without the pet..

[Desna]

So dev team answer for people asking for more dps option was SGE with its Kardia mechanic, providing a heal each time you execute a dps spell.


SGE doesn't have more damaging option than the others.

Really it doesn't heal well using it's DMG based set either. You put Kardia on the tank and Dosis your brains out and the Tank is gonna die because the heal produced is...really really weak. The other options cost so much MP and time and placement in places where healers shouldn't be that the whole idea of doing damage to heal really...is a lolipop instead of a meal. The concept has some merit, World of Warcraft attempted it when Mists of Pandaria dropped with the Monk class, they had a melee based set of heals buy, it was decided it was overpowered when it worked well enough to keep people alive and the class went through huge changes until it ended up playing out more like...a druid that smacks things. Sage has real potential, and having played in WoW during Mists and run a Monk and watched where that went wrong? I can see why SE is stepping gingerly. Too much healing through damage and the class becomes OP in its role, but I do think right now it's not delivering. Dosis should generate a larger heal if it's supposed to be tank maintenance, goodness knows tanks will overpull and run out of CDs and you'll still be hitting your other skills plenty so it wouldn't dwarf the rest of the toolkit if that produced say 10% more throughput (just in the heal, absolutely don't make it hit harder because a healer should never get close to being a dps that heals) on the whole, make it the classes bread and butter and players could enjoy that feel of being an offensive healer a little more.

[Nethereal]

Really it doesn't heal well using it's DMG based set either. You put Kardia on the tank and Dosis your brains out and the Tank is gonna die because the heal produced is...really really weak. The other options cost so much MP and time and placement in places where healers shouldn't be that the whole idea of doing damage to heal really...is a lolipop instead of a meal. The concept has some merit, World of Warcraft attempted it when Mists of Pandaria dropped with the Monk class, they had a melee based set of heals buy, it was decided it was overpowered when it worked well enough to keep people alive and the class went through huge changes until it ended up playing out more like...a druid that smacks things. Sage has real potential, and having played in WoW during Mists and run a Monk and watched where that went wrong? I can see why SE is stepping gingerly. Too much healing through damage and the class becomes OP in its role, but I do think right now it's not delivering. Dosis should generate a larger heal if it's supposed to be tank maintenance, goodness knows tanks will overpull and run out of CDs and you'll still be hitting your other skills plenty so it wouldn't dwarf the rest of the toolkit if that produced say 10% more throughput (just in the heal, absolutely don't make it hit harder because a healer should never get close to being a dps that heals) on the whole, make it the classes bread and butter and players could enjoy that feel of being an offensive healer a little more.

If kardia isn't noticeable you're not doing relevant content. This is especially true for Eos.

I get your point though.

[Supersnow845]

If kardia isn't noticeable you're not doing relevant content. This is especially true for Eos.

I get your point though.

I mean SGE is drowning in so many free heals that you honestly could do basically any content with no kardia, like honestly total kardia contribution could probably be equaled by the potency of druachole for all the addersgall you don’t need to use in an average fight

Kardia is inherently a good mechanic but SGE needs to rely on it more, not just a set and forget that basically never ends up actually being that relevant except in very high tank damage phases

[Absurdity]

I mean SGE is drowning in so many free heals that you honestly could do basically any content with no kardia, like honestly total kardia contribution could probably be equaled by the potency of druachole for all the addersgall you don’t need to use in an average fight

It was actually quite noticeable in P4S phase 2.