Why do casuals act as if it's the end of the world when suggesting?

[LeonKeyh]

I actually kinda use that quest as a benchmark for determining a players skill. I read a thread about it on these forums before I got to that part of MSQ and was horrified and terrified. I did it on normal, first try, with a couple minutes to spare. Thats far from a brag, im bad at games and I know it. The fact that people were struggling with that, really put things in perspective for me.

I had to run it twice because I put my controller down to grab a drink right before the quick time event lol.

Here's my argument and it's something that comes up A LOT in Final Fantasy 14, this is just a good example of it:

I loved In from the Cold because of the lack of direction and the feeling of hopelessness and powerlessness. But it was bad game design whenever you look at it within the context of Final Fantasy 14. FF14 holds your hand during the entirety of the game between the quest markers, "v.easy/easy" difficulty on solo duties, and Duty Finder parties easily carrying players. The game does a very bad job at fostering player skill and a very bad job at slowly pushing people to improve, instead they just offer ways to get around any sort of challenge that the player isn't interested in dealing with. You really can't drop something like In from the Cold onto these people who have been spoon fed easy content for hundreds of hours.

IMO at least.

That being said, I think that people should have been able to clear it if they just calmed down and looked around like they were supposed to, but it's like they were playing Mario 64 and suddenly ended up in a different game.

[Rilifane]

I hope we can have a reasonable conversation about this, you seem reasonable.

Your post here to me just makes it seem like (obviously) different people want different things from this game. Like, everything you listed in that post as a negative, I view as a positive. Yoshi P and SE can, and will make mistakes of course. But they have to cater to the majority. Things like "Into the Cold" or whatever getting nerfed isn't done in a vaccum. They probably saw massive complaints or had data showing road blocks for a significant number of players at that part, and reacted accordingly.

I assure you, things will go your way when they start seeing players quit for reason "game too easy."

That isn't happening.

The problem is that part of the playerbase gets forced into something without a choice while the other gets to enjoy things their way.
Does anyone here mind a "story mode" in single players?
Probably not and the reason is that there is a choice. Someone can play a game in story mode, it doesn't affect me in the slightest because I can just play it on hard. If someone wants to play a game in coop with me but is dead set on story mode, I'll simply decline, find like-minded people and play it on hard with them.

MSQ is set to story mode.
All dungeons are set to story mode.
Open world (fates, hunts) is set to story mode.
Alliance and normal raids are set to a bit above story mode.
Bozja is set to story mode except for duels and DR savage.

The only things not set to story mode is content that is one boss on a platform, has to be done with 8 players and via PF/ static unless you're on JP, is not part of daily/ weekly tasks and requires a higher amount of time at once. You don't do a "quick ultimate", you don't spontaneously queue for p3s. Hopping into ex farm for 15min is considered a-hole behaviour and for good reason.
The famous response to the current state of healers would be just as tone-deaf if used for this problem.
There is no midcore content and there is no choice for how you do your weekly homework. My only ways to cap tomes right now are experts (story mode, yawn...), hunts (same), roulettes at 90 (pray I get a rarely done duty with clownfiesta), farming Aglaia (clownfiesta please, please, please).
I'd kill for 4man content with scaling difficulty that is an alternative route for catch up gear and tome farming. Or for slightly increased difficulty of MSQ with Duty Support (once expanded for all MSQ content) being the default story mode unless you change settings. Nobody is excluded from completing MSQ this way.

If if was entirely up to me, I'd go for a gradual, smooth increase in difficulty that lets people learn naturally without them even noticing while also offering tutorials like Hall of Novice/ Intermediate/ Advanced to refresh memory or give additional ways to learn if someone wants to. But I suppose that ship has long sailed and SE is already set on going the spoonfeeding route.
If they do it they at least need to give others the options to not get spoonfed outside savage/ ultimate. I'd prefer to be treated as if I have a functioning brain, thanks.

[EgilTheStressedMage]

In from the cold's problem is that it was not completely clear even with context clues how to clear it without using a guide first. Unless you found the downed mech or the fuel first before trying to find the linear path out you were likely to get murdered by the machina near the exit without understanding what you were supposed to do to get past them.

Casual here. I cleared it on my first try without any guide well before the nerf and with the threat of disconnection.

[kaynide]

The problem is that part of the playerbase gets forced into something without a choice while the other gets to enjoy things their way.
Does anyone here mind a "story mode" in single players?

Nobody is being forced to do anything though. The game is advertised as being an easy "for everyone" kinda game. It has never even tried to claim it was some kind of hardcore-game. The devs have continually made it very clear that they want to cast as wide a net as possible and get as many players in this game as possible, which means designing for non-gamers.

To claim that the base game is supposed to be hard or that it's dumbed down is just not the reality. It's designed to be super-accessible and easy; claiming it's supposed to be hard is like going into a Wendy's and complaining that we're forced to eat burgers.

I love playing harder games and I love me some Tacos, and I often go for those things. But this ain't it. This is..well.. a Wendy's.

All that said, your ideas for general midcore stuff.. I'd be down personally. But I know a lot of people in my circle of friends that even midcore stuff would be dead on arrival. I think the devs know what content people are doing, and are making more of what is successful.

[Xaruko_Nexume]

Nobody is being forced to do anything though. The game is advertised as being an easy "for everyone" kinda game. It has never even tried to claim it was some kind of hardcore-game. The devs have continually made it very clear that they want to cast as wide a net as possible and get as many players in this game as possible, which means designing for non-gamers.

To claim that the base game is supposed to be hard or that it's dumbed down is just not the reality. It's designed to be super-accessible and easy; claiming it's supposed to be hard is like going into a Wendy's and complaining that we're forced to eat burgers.

I love playing harder games and I love me some Tacos, and I often go for those things. But this ain't it. This is..well.. a Wendy's.

I hope that players who want a hard game realize that this isn't who this game is designed for. There is nothing wrong with asking them to change it, and they have a right to voice their opinion and their desires for the game of course. But they need to understand this games target audience. FFXIV is a beautiful marriage of the theme park MMO and sand box. It's a living breathing world with nightly player driven events everywhere, at least on my server, so yes, it is sand box too. It's the kind of game where many players can and do play for dozens of hours not doing any "combat" content and still have a great time. And still yet, there are extremes, savages, and ultimates etc.

That they are trying to cater toward people who want these harder things, and having witnessed other MMO developers basically tell entire section of their community to piss off, I would think players here would be more grateful that things like extremes, savages, and ultimates even exist at all, when you consider how few of their customers even ever see them. Especially ults.

It's the equivalent of ordering pasta at Wendy's, but only in this case, Wendy's is kind enough to actually try and provide some sort of pasta. if you don't like it, there are other restaurants across the street.

[Rilifane]

Nobody is being forced to do anything though. The game is advertised as being an easy "for everyone" kinda game. It has never even tried to claim it was some kind of hardcore-game. The devs have continually made it very clear that they want to cast as wide a net as possible and get as many players in this game as possible, which means designing for non-gamers.

To claim that the base game is supposed to be hard or that it's dumbed down is just not the reality. It's designed to be super-accessible and easy; claiming it's supposed to be hard is like going into a Wendy's and complaining that we're forced to eat burgers.

I love playing harder games and I love me some Tacos, and I often go for those things. But this ain't it. This is..well.. a Wendy's.

All that said, your ideas for general midcore stuff.. I'd be down personally. But I know a lot of people in my circle of friends that even midcore stuff would be dead on arrival. I think the devs know what content people are doing, and are making more of what is successful.

I didn't say the game is supposed to be hard or hardcore nor did I ask for it to become hard, did I?
So I don't get what you are argueing here.

Don't jump to conclusions or put words in my mouth and then argueing against them just because I used the word hard in relation to single-player games. I explicitely mentioned that the game lacks midcore content.

[Caitlyn]

When it comes to difficulty, Savage, Ex and Ultimate are totally fine. Same for most leveling dungeons.

But any dungeon on 50/60/70/80/90 needs to be harder. They are so easy, you cant even wipe them. Having a WAR in your group, who needs a healer? Ironically, those dungeons are labeled as "expert" dungeons. This moment when the hard mode is easier than the normal mode.

And 24 man raids are way to easy, too. In a normal group, you spent maybe 20 mins in it. But if feels like an eternity, because each boss fight is just doing damage, do one heal and maybe make a step to the side. I would prefer an intense 5 min boss fight over a boring 10 min boss fight.

[Tehmon]

And 24 man raids are way to easy, too. In a normal group, you spent maybe 20 mins in it. But if feels like an eternity, because each boss fight is just doing damage, do one heal and maybe make a step to the side. I would prefer an intense 5 min boss fight over a boring 10 min boss fight.

You say this, but the queues for these alliance raids takes absolutely forever outside of CT. Are you saying people don't queue for these raids because they are too slow and too easy?

[Xaruko_Nexume]

When it comes to difficulty, Savage, Ex and Ultimate are totally fine. Same for most leveling dungeons.

But any dungeon on 50/60/70/80/90 needs to be harder. They are so easy, you cant even wipe them. Having a WAR in your group, who needs a healer? Ironically, those dungeons are labeled as "expert" dungeons. This moment when the hard mode is easier than the normal mode.

And 24 man raids are way to easy, too. In a normal group, you spent maybe 20 mins in it. But if feels like an eternity, because each boss fight is just doing damage, do one heal and maybe make a step to the side. I would prefer an intense 5 min boss fight over a boring 10 min boss fight.

Im sorry, but I witness proof that goes against everything you have just said on a daily basis. Wipes in 4 person content, wipes to ancient flares, wipes to curtain calls, wipes galore in Neir raids etc. And no its not always my fault, and in fact rarely is but I can hear someone already saying its because im in the group haha.

Get Titania with a couple new people? Plan on being there until the end of the clock. Dun Scaith first boss? People leave, wipe, etc. Maybe your data center is just that much hardcore and thats fine. Oh and Diablos wipes are super common and the thunder god and the three sisters in the tower of babel. I keep editing and thinking of more each time that are often disasters so I will just stop.

[Ivtrix]

Im sorry, but I witness proof that goes against everything you have just said on a daily basis. Wipes in 4 person content, wipes to ancient flares, wipes to curtain calls, wipes galore in Neir raids etc. And no its not always my fault, and in fact rarely is but I can hear someone already saying its because im in the group haha.

Get Titania with a couple new people? Plan on being there until the end of the clock. Dun Scaith first boss? People leave, wipe, etc. Maybe your data center is just that much hardcore and thats fine. Oh and Diablos wipes are super common and the thunder god and the three sisters in the tower of babel. I keep editing and thinking of more each time that are often disasters so I will just stop.

???

None of this happens on crystal. Are you sure? You play on Primal, the hardcore raiding server.