They Should Add An Official Damage Meter With One Condition

[Gothicshark]

Any reason behind your firm opinion on this one? Assuming SE keep a zero tolerance against any cases of people harassing over parser numbers, what's driving your stance?

theres no way you would quit. im calling that bluff right now.

Nah. You're too invested in it.

December 2004 to October 13th 2020. Never looking back.

I had 20 max level Characters (both factions), I had 5 Max Geared Raiding Characters, to include my Main a Blue Side Warlock which I had as a main since May 2005. I played 40+ hours a week before I retired, and 70-80 hours a week after I retired. I only quit twice, once for 5 months near the End of Panda Land in protest over a flying announcement (When I first came to FFXIV), and the day of Shadowland Prepatch, as I refused to go back to level 50.

I deleted my account when their misogynistic history came out.

I am sick and tired of toxic WOW mentalities and Damage Meters, because I lived 18 years of my adult life dealing with them.

Would you still quit if the damage meter was something that had to be enabled in the UI and was only personal? (ie. I could only see myself and you could only see yourself)

If so, can you please explain your reasoning?

Because people will always find a way to make an addon/app to detect the information, and there will always be a group of people who use that info to determine weather or not a person should be allowed into a group. Sure, they might not say things in public, but in private spaces, and on Discord, the information will be used to judge people, and no matter how good intentioned, it will always be used for ill. If Yoshi-P allows for even a personal meter, that is allowing for that information to become necessary for raiding. The only way that is acceptable, is if they added a personal solo challenge that gave out you numbers at the end. This way, it would be personal, and would be usable as a self improvement tool, and not a test of ability.

[anhaato]

I had 20 max level Characters (both factions), I had 5 Max Geared Raiding Characters, to include my Main a Blue Side Warlock which I had as a main since May 2005. I played 40+ hours a week before I retired, and 70-80 hours a week after I retired. I only quit twice, once for 5 months near the End of Panda Land in protest over a flying announcement (When I first came to FFXIV), and the day of Shadowland Prepatch, as I refused to go back to level 50.

I deleted my account when their misogynistic history came out.

I am sick and tired of toxic WOW mentalities and Damage Meters, because I lived 18 years of my adult life dealing with them.

You're not convincing anyone by listing reasons that have nothing to do with damage meters. In fact, you're just proving further that WOW's downfall was NOT due to damage meters.

[Shurrikhan]

DPS meters alone do not improve player performance, since they do nothing to explain why a player may not be performing well. All they do is simply show damage output, it would be up to the other players, or in game tutorials, to help players improve and given the history of this community I really doubt that would happen.

Yet you can try different things and observe: Over repeated tests, did the numbers go up?

Not to mention that the most immediate per-second meter itself is only a small part of the available system. Take WoW's typical parsers as example.

• Want to track when and for how long you dropped a buff via a timeline and event chart? You can do that.
• Want to compare your action timeline against another of your own logs, or perhaps even compare each against their respective throughputs? You can do that.
• Want to find the most salient points of difference between how you played and a fellow player in your party of the same spec played? You can do that, too.

They have rather immense potential as learning tools.

[Rolder50]

Yet you can try different things and observe: Over repeated tests, did the numbers go up?

Not to mention that the most immediate per-second meter itself is only a small part of the available system. Take WoW's typical parsers as example.

• Want to track when and for how long you dropped a buff via a timeline and event chart? You can do that.
• Want to compare your action timeline against another of your own logs, or perhaps even compare each against their respective throughputs? You can do that.
• Want to find the most salient points of difference between how you played and a fellow player in your party of the same spec played? You can do that, too.

They have rather immense potential as learning tools.

Fun fact, you can do this with FF14 parsers as well, you just have to upload the log to a website and it can chart all this out.

[Shurrikhan]

Fun fact, you can do this with FF14 parsers as well, you just have to upload the log to a website and it can chart all this out.

Aye, I just like Detail's convenience for being able to do that in-game, no upload necessary. (Though, one would still need the upload for, say, running a 2D replay of the fight, as offered on Warcraftlogs, or for running their quick analyses, so it's still plenty worth uploading from time to time there.)

[Yeastyloins]

Tbh that statement of yours is why the devs don't want it in game. If someone is going to say something like that without parsers in game, imagine if they were added. Probably be a lot worse and then nothing can really be done about it. A lot of people who keep trying to push for parsers to be added in game just keep proving yoshi's point as to why they should not be added.

It's an honest thing. Though rather than a dps meter I would prefer if there were IN game means to teach people mechanics. I did the stuff with the smith when I first started playing and I don't think it adequately teaches new players these kinds of things. Things like considered AoE usage and when its again, considering using CDs when you get buffs. It would be simple way to implement it.

The largest issue is the game itself does a terrible job of teaching how to play in multiple scenarios. WoW has a "tutorial" like section when you boost a character where they have you practice both single target and AoE/Cleave abilities, core interactions within your toolkit, and important defensive/utilities. The initial job quests for RPR and SGE do have something like that but its very barebones.

[Yeastyloins]

They will not add DPS metter for the same reason chat is disabled in PvP, even if harrasment is against ToS, people would do it more often when the option is in the game and mods will have extra work.

On other side, FF is not made to have any DPS metter and (surprise, surprise), DPS metters are not accurate at the moment and they were never accurate. Big portion of the DMG is calculated with formulas or simulations to work around missing numbers or information. If SE are releasing thier own metter, they should provide accurate tool that guarantee proper numbers and with the current system that is not possible. I don't believe they will rewrite the entire workflow of dps'ing to help the part of the community that just can't understand how the battle system works and can't live without DPS metter.

How so? ACT pulls information from the battle log. Any aberrations in the combat log either prevent it from being uploaded to FF logs or if it is, FF logs will not assign a ranking to it.

[Shurrikhan]

It's an honest thing. Though rather than a dps meter I would prefer if there were IN game means to teach people mechanics.

These aren't mutually exclusive, though, and usually the best way to put advice to practice is with, also, the ability to see clearly and objectively whether you've gotten it to work.

[Batbrat]

Only way it would work is if they had a very very strict rule about how you talk to others about parses. Along with of course, private parse only. I think basically no matter what, as long as they make it an immediate ban for bringing up someones parse numbers that it's fine since thats how it works right now anyway and it keeps people civil.

I'd like to repeat that actually. That's what keeps people civil.
A lot of people already use parsing things. but they're terrified of opening their mouths because they dont want a ban. And thats exactly how it should always stay. They could simply add them in but keep that level of strictness up and it'd be perfect. I say this with like 10+ years of mmos behind me. Parsing in itself isnt actually awful, its 1000% all in how people treat each other over it. If you let that run rampant, yes, it seriously changes and warps people into nasty little freaks and the games enjoyability plummets hard and fast driving many out because who wants to bother when EVERY run of EVERYTHING is about 'fast parse runs only'. Go on, ask blade and soul. Anyone pretending otherwise is just naive/inexperienced with mmos-or even worse, they were one of the ones doing it and see nothing wrong with it. Its just that behavior that needs to be controlled. So as long as they forever keep those types muzzled in fear of losing their accounts then yah maybe someday it could be possible.

[Elesh]

Because people will always find a way to make an addon/app to detect the information, and there will always be a group of people who use that info to determine weather or not a person should be allowed into a group. Sure, they might not say things in public, but in private spaces, and on Discord, the information will be used to judge people, and no matter how good intentioned, it will always be used for ill. If Yoshi-P allows for even a personal meter, that is allowing for that information to become necessary for raiding. The only way that is acceptable, is if they added a personal solo challenge that gave out you numbers at the end. This way, it would be personal, and would be usable as a self improvement tool, and not a test of ability.

This argument has a really flawed premise to it. You're basing whether good people can have something based off of whether bad people could misuse it...

By that right we shouldn't have chat in the game. At all. No ability to chat. Because people who are mean can use it to harass people. We also shouldn't have gear, because people can judge people based off of it. And we shouldn't have glam, because people get judged based off of their tastes in glam.

Any system you add to the game... hell, anything that exists can be misused by people with the wrong attitude and intention to hurt people.

That doesn't mean we just... never do anything. No, we punish the people who misuse it.