Revelations from Patch 6.1

[SannaR]

I do know there is a node that gives a 5,0000 mark for I'd say since the end of Allag as it says something like it's been 5,000 years since a great wyrm broke free of it's containment and nothing has been done about it. I want to say it's near the docking bay.

[YianKutku]

I do know there is a node that gives a 5,0000 mark for I'd say since the end of Allag as it says something like it's been 5,000 years since a great wyrm broke free of it's containment and nothing has been done about it. I want to say it's near the docking bay.

It's kind of frustratingly vague, because the statement generally given is "the Allagan Empire existed 5,000 years ago". Which can mean anything from "the Allagan Empire was at its height 5,000 years ago", and "the Allagan Empire ended 5,000 years ago".

We know that the Crystal Tower was built long after the original Xande died, because it was supposed to represent the Allagan Empire at its most prosperous. And from prior lore interviews, we also know the construction of the Crystal Tower took a very long time, enough that the style of construction would be different from beginning to end, which was the lore reason given for why the architecture of the Labyrinth Of The Ancients looked so different to the architecture of Syrcus Tower.

So I can believe that the time between Xande unifying Eorzea into the Allagan Empire to the finished construction of the Crystal Tower to be a thousand years, between the "6,000 years" number of when original Xande rose to power, and the "5,000 years" of when the Allagan Empire "existed". It is much more difficult to believe that the Allagan Empire lasted only a thousand years (or thereabouts, like the Sixth Astral Era lasting 1.5k years), since it would require Xande uniting Eorzea, then the Empire conquering the rest of the Three Great Continents, then the Empire building the Crystal Tower (both Labyrinth and Syrcus), then the Empire falling into decadence, then Amon resurrecting Xande, then New Xande waging war on and conquering Meracydia, then the whole Void Gate thing... it's too short a period of time, even assuming the discovery of Omega accelerated some progress. Compare to the thousand years of the Dragonsong War, where not much actually did happen.

[KageTokage]

Considering how quickly the Garlean Empire rose to become a global superpower with Emet-Selch's influence, I wouldn't consider it that much of a stretch personally.

[Enkidoh]

Something I'm curious about and having trouble wrapping my mind around. In the future G'raha came from that we prevented, the First was in the process of rejoining with the source. Why was the First able to rejoin after being flooded by Light, but the 13th wasn't able to after being flooded by Darkness? What's the difference? Someone said it might have to do with either Black Rose being released at the same time as the First starting to rejoin, or that the 13th was "tethered" to the source by the contract with the Cloud of Darkness and couldn't rejoin due to that. I'm really confused. xD Sorry if this is the wrong thread to ask in. I didn't want to make an entirely new thread to ask this question. My apologies.

Shadowbringers explained this: Yes, when the First was being consumed by Light Aether, on the Source the same elemental type of Calamity was occurring with Black Rose. (This also makes Heavensward and Thordan's Ascian-supported attempt to become a Light-themed Primal to wipe out the dragons and try to conqueror Eorzea make sense - Black Rose was the back-up plan.) When Igheryorm caused the 13th Shard to be consumed by Darkness, the other Ascians hadn't caused an equal Darkness Calamity on the Source, so the 13th just sits there.

Not just that - the First was only able to be Rejoined in the first place (pun intended), because it's Flood was stopped a century before by Minfilia-wielding-Hydaelyn's-powers and Ardbert's friends' sacrificing themselves to halt it. Enough of the world remained intact in Norvrandt (in other words, enough remained aspected to other elements) for Emet to set it up to be Rejoined with the Source by having it's Light-aspected (as in Astral, stasis and order) interacting with the Empire's Black Rose chemical weapon (which as it turns out was already Light-aspected).

The Thirteenth by comparison however is bascially broken and has become entirelly consumed by Darkness-aspected aether, turning it into the Void, so it cannot be Rejoined as it is due to no other elements really remaining there, everything is warped to Darkness (as in, Umbral - activity and chaos).

It remains to be seen if and how the Ascians might have fixed things enough on the Thirteenth eventually to Rejoin it too as the 'final part of the puzzle', but I guess we'll never know now.

EDIT: sorry for jumping back to this - VBulletin has a bug that will not sent you to the right page clicking the 'Most Recent Post' link so I mistakenly thought yours was the most recent post Denisha. I'm really sorry about that! ; ;

[Denishia]

EDIT: sorry for jumping back to this - VBulletin has a bug that will not sent you to the right page clicking the 'Most Recent Post' link so I mistakenly thought yours was the most recent post Denisha. I'm really sorry about that! ; ;

Lol, no worries there! Though it does remind me of that burning question of just what was up with Lahabrea's plans involving the Ultima weapon - was he really trying to cause a Calamity with it and if so, with the elemental component necessity, does this confirm that Ultima is a White Mage spell (like FFII) and was it supposed to be paired with the First? Thordan for the initial Flood of Light and then Black Rose is easy to map. The Source can't overload and Flood into one element like the Shards - or can it? that feels like an assumption. But no wonder Elidibus appears and does his bad faith emissary act if Lahabrea was messing up the Ascian timetables and about to cause another Thirteenth disaster. I have the mental image of two Ascians on idk, Shard Six, getting a memo from Lahabrea on what they think is their holiday break (as if the Unsundered ever let the Sundered Ascians have a break, doubtful) demanding a Calamity Flood ASAP, only to get a second memo from Elidibus two weeks later rescinding the previous order and demanding attendance for a general meeting.

[kaynide]

Raid related:

I think the "Gods" are some of the more powerful Ancient familiars that survived the sundering, etc. Basically magical animals that have lived so long they have become somewhat Godlike. I also think the 3.0 series with the 4 lords to be the same or similar thing, also making a future "You need to complete the 4 lords raid series to do the next thing".

As seen with the moon rabbits and Meteion, familiars can be given quite potent levels of power including creation magic. Doesn't seem such a far stretch to me.

[Catwho]

We know that the Crystal Tower was built long after the original Xande died, because it was supposed to represent the Allagan Empire at its most prosperous. And from prior lore interviews, we also know the construction of the Crystal Tower took a very long time, enough that the style of construction would be different from beginning to end, which was the lore reason given for why the architecture of the Labyrinth Of The Ancients looked so different to the architecture of Syrcus Tower.

I could totally believe it happening in even a shorter period of time. Thinking of the local university campus - the buildings that are 250 years old have a WILDLY different architectural style than the ones that were built 50 years ago. And then they realized in the 2000s that it was making campus look really patchwork, so they decided on a unified standard for all new construction that didn't involved whatever the latest fad trend in architecture was. (Seriously, the stuff that was built in the '60s is really out there - cantilevers, swooping columns, floating stairways... looks like the Lopporits designed the chemistry building.)

Don't forget that it was all being done by Ascian power, too.

[Lium]

Raid related:

I think the "Gods" are some of the more powerful Ancient familiars that survived the sundering, etc. Basically magical animals that have lived so long they have become somewhat Godlike. I also think the 3.0 series with the 4 lords to be the same or similar thing, also making a future "You need to complete the 4 lords raid series to do the next thing".

As seen with the moon rabbits and Meteion, familiars can be given quite potent levels of power including creation magic. Doesn't seem such a far stretch to me.

Never thought of that and it’s in all likelihood what it is. Or at least a very good possibility.

The question would be who created them. Venat created the rabbits, Hermes created Meteion, so I wonder if the Twelve were created by someone like Hythlodaeus. Or maybe even Azem as a way to watch over mortals in the absence of the Ancients. That sort of fits with the Azime Steppe being named after Azem, etc. I could see someone of the Convocation creating guardians of immense power to protect mortals to a degree. After all, the Ascians are trying to save the Source, not destroy it. So as the Rejoinings will undoubtedly cause the death and suffering of many, they would need to make sure that many others survive it somehow. Hence, the Twelve. Just speculating, of course. But very interesting!

[kaynide]

Never thought of that and it’s in all likelihood what it is. Or at least a very good possibility.

The question would be who created them. Venat created the rabbits, Hermes created Meteion, so I wonder if the Twelve were created by someone like Hythlodaeus. Or maybe even Azem as a way to watch over mortals in the absence of the Ancients. That sort of fits with the Azime Steppe being named after Azem, etc. I could see someone of the Convocation creating guardians of immense power to protect mortals to a degree. After all, the Ascians are trying to save the Source, not destroy it. So as the Rejoinings will undoubtedly cause the death and suffering of many, they would need to make sure that many others survive it somehow. Hence, the Twelve. Just speculating, of course. But very interesting!

I assume Venat created all of them as a backup plan, as they deem it necessary to appear after her fall.

Moreover, they refer to the magic attempt at binding Bahamut as being a primal summoning. I’m assuming at some point Venat introduced gods to help guide early civilization as they seem genuinely benign and have a desire to be helpful. This could mean the Ascians used this when they supposedly taught Louisioux how to do primal summoning.

(I say supposedly as while I am not sure they did, they have a history of playing two sides against each other and forcing a primal summoning cataclysm. “Teaching” him could have just literally been making a tome available to him to “find”.)

/10characters..

[EaraGrace]

I assume Venat created all of them as a backup plan, as they deem it necessary to appear after her fall.

Moreover, they refer to the magic attempt at binding Bahamut as being a primal summoning. I’m assuming at some point Venat introduced gods to help guide early civilization as they seem genuinely benign and have a desire to be helpful. This could mean the Ascians used this when they supposedly taught Louisioux how to do primal summoning.

(I say supposedly as while I am not sure they did, they have a history of playing two sides against each other and forcing a primal summoning cataclysm. “Teaching” him could have just literally been making a tome available to him to “find”.)

/10characters..

I’m not sure if I get backup plan vibes from them. Right now I’m looking with an eyebrow raised at

the big structure in the back with a floor that matches the teleporters to the other Heavens. The fact it matches the crystal in the center has me goin