What's up with the cone aoes hate?

[Seraphor]

Even if WAR was consistently cones, which would be better than the inconsistency, cones are still inferior to 360 degree AoEs.
During a pull, mobs naturally crowd around the tank, forcing you to constantly reposition every time you use your cone attack. Maybe this wasn't all that apparent before when you were forced to reposition every single GCD anyway because you were swapping between cone and 360, but if they just made all of WAR's AoEs cones, you'd still be playing it the same stupid janky way.
And if you play multiple tanks at all, the inconsistency is jarring. You build up a natural sense of when a mob is in range, so that you can run through the pack and AoE at the right time to grab them all. Having a cone completely throws off this sense.

[Sani2341]

Even if WAR was consistently cones, which would be better than the inconsistency, cones are still inferior to 360 degree AoEs.

Still not seeing how with the 6.0 impelemntation the longer cone (goign from the PC) was in anyway not better than the follow up AoE.

During a pull, mobs naturally crowd around the tank, forcing you to constantly reposition every time you use your cone attack. Maybe this wasn't all that apparent before when you were forced to reposition every single GCD anyway

You'll still need to reposition regularly to dodge trash pack AoEs. So that's not changing much if anything. Pretty Sure I was moving around as much on GNB just to avoid AoEs as I was with WAR to avoid them, and keep everything in the cone.

but if they just made all of WAR's AoEs cones, you'd still be playing it the same stupid janky way.

I mean it was more than fine back when we just had the Cone for spammable AoE. (well for a given value of Spammable, deleting TP was one of the few welcome changes ShB brought)

[Seraphor]

I mean it was more than fine back when we just had the Cone for spammable AoE. (well for a given value of Spammable, deleting TP was one of the few welcome changes ShB brought)

Agree to disagree. The cone is the sole reason I've refused to play WAR for the past 5 years and can now finally play it.

[Sani2341]

Agree to disagree. The cone is the sole reason I've refused to play WAR for the past 5 years and can now finally play it.

As if there werent 2-3 other tanks with no cone aoe to play during that time.

Now there's only Tanks without cones, so everyone who prefers those is now Out of tanks to play, just so those that dislike them can have a 30% larger selection of tanks to their taste.

[Seraphor]

As if there werent 2-3 other tanks with no cone aoe to play during that time.

Now there's only Tanks without cones, so everyone who prefers those is now Out of tanks to play, just so those that dislike them can have a 30% larger selection of tanks to their taste.

I might agree with this if, like I said, mobs didn't naturally reposition themselves around the tank, and there were two tanks who utilised just cone AoEs. Then you could claim it was simply a different paradigm. But it's not, it works counter to the base mechanics of dungeon pulls.

[Kuritzkale]

I might agree with this if, like I said, mobs didn't naturally reposition themselves around the tank, and there were two tanks who utilised just cone AoEs. Then you could claim it was simply a different paradigm. But it's not, it works counter to the base mechanics of dungeon pulls.

Weird then, that for... what, 9 years now? Warrior has had a cone AOE on overpower, and it's been perfectly fine, hasn't added significantly to the difficulty in a new player picking up the job, yet allows more experienced players to get the most out of the cone AOE and potentially use it in a more effective way than a simple circle AOE. But god forbid the game allows people to utilize their job actions in more skillful ways as they become more experienced, now EVERY tank can play the exact same in dungeon pulls, thank god! Wouldn't want a new player to have to think about how to most effectively use the job they chose for more than a second, that would be scary and offputting to all the stardew valley players that want to play through the game for their ERP glamours and kawaii moments between their catgirl and g'raha tia or whatever.

[Dxzstar]

I might agree with this if, like I said, mobs didn't naturally reposition themselves around the tank, and there were two tanks who utilised just cone AoEs. Then you could claim it was simply a different paradigm. But it's not, it works counter to the base mechanics of dungeon pulls.

So I have a question. Do you feel there is any issue with DRK's usage of lines for their aoe's? Since those are arguably vastly more frustrating to properly line up. Do you think Flood and Shadowbringer should become circular? What of BRD and MCH as well? I'm sorry if this seems patronizing but it seems like you don't really mind those so I kinda wanna confirm and if so, ask why?

[Seraphor]

So I have a question. Do you feel there is any issue with DRK's usage of lines for their aoe's? Since those are arguably vastly more frustrating to properly line up. Do you think Flood and Shadowbringer should become circular? What of BRD and MCH as well? I'm sorry if this seems patronizing but it seems like you don't really mind those so I kinda wanna confirm and if so, ask why?

DRK's is still questionable, but ranged DPS are designed to be, you know, at ranged, that's where cones work.

[PangTong]

So I have a question. Do you feel there is any issue with DRK's usage of lines for their aoe's? Since those are arguably vastly more frustrating to properly line up. Do you think Flood and Shadowbringer should become circular? What of BRD and MCH as well? I'm sorry if this seems patronizing but it seems like you don't really mind those so I kinda wanna confirm and if so, ask why?

IMO yes Flood should absolutely be a circle. Line AoEs are okay on a DPS as you are free to move about to get the perfect line that hits all the mobs. On a tank, the mobs follow you and crowd around you, they do not politely queue up to be hit by your narrow line attack.

I don't really mind cone AoEs, what bothered me about Overpower is that it was the one cone AoE on a job where every other AoE was a circle, including the next step of the AoE combo. It means you constantly have to go in and out of the pack to hit everything, which is really annoying as a tank as it causes all the mobs to jiggle around which messes up the party's AoE too. I'd have been fine if they went the opposite direction and made Mythril Tempest, Decimate and Chaotic Cyclone into cones. I'm fine with BRD and MCH having all cones for that reason.

It's not so bad if the aoe shape disparity only happens every so often. For example SAM still has to hit a cone for Ogi Namikiri, MNK has to hit a line for Enlightenment (although Enlightenment is annoying for different reasons). But when it's every other combo attack it gets a bit tiresome. So I'd be okay with keeping Shadowbringer as a line, or more preferably a cone. But Flood should be a circle without question.

[Sani2341]

I might agree with this if, like I said, mobs didn't naturally reposition themselves around the tank, and there were two tanks who utilised just cone AoEs. Then you could claim it was simply a different paradigm. But it's not, it works counter to the base mechanics of dungeon pulls.

Quick reminder that until HW, 50% of Tankjobs were WAR with, afaik, at that time just the cone, and until ShB it was still 33% of Tankjobs that had just the cone for spammable AoE.
So saying it needs to be 2 or more tanks that have something basicly equates too 'No there shouldn't be a few options catering to less common tastes' because apperently, only the clear majority of options is valid.