What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

[CrownySuccubus]

No that doesn't make sense, since you actually need a lot of positivity to push through the bad times. If the despair increases then so does the feelings of hope and determination, remember, all emotions, there is no implication anywhere that her powers to absorb every feeling was altered or in any respect dimmer, and given that she had the mental capacity of an entire collective she should very much have been able to understand why people do choose to go on. I'm not debating that she developed a fatalistic viewpoint, what I am debating is that the concepts that enables people to power through the worst of times seemed so alien and meaningless to her. Like the concept of personal battle and triumph just did not exist. It's just weird and whiny in the end, and hilariously self righteous. They ultimately put an immature kid in a position of power with nothing but a hopped up teen emo perspective, it doesn't make for a compelling villain

Well, you just touched upon one of the core fallacies and nonsensical issues with the premise of Endwalker. The very nature of Ultima Thule and the Endsinger makes the argument that the emotional weight of an entire civilization is only has relevance in its final generation. Imagine if we judged the worth of the Roman Empire ONLY by those who were present when it was sacked. Or the Byzantine Empire ONLY after its people were conquered and slaughtered by the Ottomans. We're supposed to believe that because the natives of the Americas were enslaved, driven out and ultimately subjected to genocide by European settlers, that the older generations might as well never lived at all. That we living in the present day must secretly yearn for death just because at some point, some generation of humanity will be the last one.

This has to be true in FFXIV's world or else Ultima Thule couldn't exist.

[Lauront]

Uhhh I'm not done yet but what are the chances the people that screamed "Ancients are mean and lacking in empathy look how they treat their familiars!!" are going to see the irony of-

Y'shtola creating two familiars purely for the purpose of sending them into the Void to test how messed up one would become without a scale. I'm sure there will be an excuse made, right?

I hadn't read Lauront's post yet but yep, good to see they're still keeping their strict adherence to "rules for thee and not for me" alive and kicking.

It's just laughable. I mean we didn't need this to make that point, because there is plenty of lore which already suffices to establish that the sundered don't give a damn about these things - less than the ancients did, for sure - but when you show up to Elpis, with soul-devouring Reaper avatar in tow, sorry if I don't take the "shock" at the petalouda being aetherically decomposed too seriously. To then have...

Y'shtola chuck a familiar in the Void, with our own character matter-of-fact-ly suggesting it depending on the option you pick... they could've had an obnoxious hypocrite Hermes ghost floating about, wagging his finger.

I think familiars/arcane constructs are generally distinguished from living things by the fact that while they can have minds, they don't possess any of the other traits typically required for something to be considered "alive" like a functioning biological anatomy (Meteion being mentioned as not being able to eat as requiring sustenance would've been a detriment to her purpose of traveling the stars), which is also one of the requisites for something to possess a soul in the first place.

It still raises an icky question of morality if those beings are still able to feel pain physically or emotionally, though...

Even sprites basically have some survival urge according to Hermes, but then what normally functioning entity doesn't? I think referring to them as simulacra in the case of beings such as primals or summons gives a strong hint as to what the likes of constructed arcane entities (egi etc.) are - they're effectively arcane AIs, but you also get naturally occurring ones, like the sprite. It's strange that the star is so fussy about what it will put a soul into, and I've a theory that there's ancient souls and then souls for plant and animal life, and maybe gradations in between, but trying to nail down anything in this setting can be tricky, especially on a topic like this. Given that G'raha is munching down on a beef patty, from a once ensouled cow raised for that purpose, I think it's clear that Hermes's "angst" was to give him some rationale in the moment that wasn't ever going to be turned into a wider point, particularly given that Venat herself does not give a toss about it, and given the behaviours we see in the sundered. At best it was just there to stimulate his existential angst regarding the purpose of life in the face of death.

We can never know how much better or worse the ancients would've fared had they been as fortunate as us. But when considering why Zodiark exists as he does and the VERY specific purpose he serves, I wonder: had Venat actually shared the truth, would Zodiark have even needed to exist as we knew him?

Exactly. All the things you mention are glossed over by it. As I said elsewhere, it's as close to a mesmerised fanboy's in-setting hagiography of her as you can get. The things it glosses over were all acknowledged at the Q&A, in interviews or in the actual game; and whilst I realise this is an in-game source, so may reflect someone's bias/lack of complete knowledge, it will still be taken as gospel by many, when the underlying reality is much more complex.

Omg, where is that picture from? Vegnat and Harmes are gone!

And what an improvement it is.

I skipped every single cutscene because I'm no longer interested in the story.

Unlocked the alliance raid and spammed it around 5 or 6 times. Loved the raid! It gave me StB vibes which is a good thing. My favorite was the second boss. Looking forward to the other 2 raids. Just glad to be done with all the Neir stuff. We'll see if the 3rd raid finally tops Orbonne for me.

I'm at the point where my interest has just drained and I will probably just check in each patch to see if it's improving and if not, focus on other stuff.

[Rulakir]

Given how much story regarding the void is behind side content it makes me wonder how much they can feasibly do with it in the MSQ. People have been saying they need to start making more raids mandatory, but that's the antithesis of their goal to make the game solo friendly (and would frankly be a deal breaker for me). I've never done The Warring Triad or finished the ShB role quests. I, the player, may know the lore, but my character has never met Unukalhai and doesn't know the truth of Cyella either. Given that they're the only two survivors of the 13th that we know of (although, someone said Elidibus could've saved more?), that seems like a big deal.

It makes me wonder how much of this is just going to continue to be side content and, if that's the case, I should severely temper my expectations because I can't see another rejoining or soul merger happening in a side quest.

[OhNooo]

I'm at the point where my interest has just drained and I will probably just check in each patch to see if it's improving and if not, focus on other stuff.

All the characters I liked were killed off and I've never liked the Scions except for Estinien. The HW style of storytelling I enjoyed doesn't seem to be coming back. So what incentive do I really have to stay invested in the story? Being forced to travel with what I consider to be bland party members is pretty frustrating. So pretty much the moment one of them opens their mouth I'm like SKIP

To be honest my favorite content in the game are the 8 man and 24 man raids and trying out different classes. So in my case, it's better for me to just focus on that and play other games when I've finished the content.

[PawPaw]

Omg, where is that picture from? Vegnat and Harmes are gone!

I made it! I really liked that final credits image and always wanted one with my character in it for myself, but I had to remove those two eyesores first. Took a couple of months of poking but now it is correct.

Given how much story regarding the void is behind side content it makes me wonder how much they can feasibly do with it in the MSQ. People have been saying they need to start making more raids mandatory, but that's the antithesis of their goal to make the game solo friendly (and would frankly be a deal breaker for me). I've never done The Warring Triad or finished the ShB role quests. I, the player, may know the lore, but my character has never met Unukalhai and doesn't know the truth of Cyella either. Given that they're the only two survivors of the 13th that we know of (although, someone said Elidibus could've saved more?), that seems like a big deal.

I had this same thought. I've done all the Role quests from ShB so I know the outcome and expected a visit to the Thirteenth to "fix" it, but I know a lot of people have not finished them and do not know the story of Unukalhai and Cylva at all. They can't make it mandatory that every player levels up 4-5 jobs in order to get that hidden story unlocked so how are they going to make the crux of those role quests known in the msq? They are quite relevant as we saw yesterday.

[KageTokage]

I am rather interested in seeing more of the void though I'm assuming it's going to be strictly through solo duties, dungeons, and perhaps a small instanced hub for the trial series.

For all we know there might not even be enough of the world left to base a proper expansion around and we'll end up making headway in fixing it through side content. If its denizens actually have a plan to bring their world "salvation" perhaps a cooperative effort on both ends could yield fruit.

[Caurcas]

If we are getting more Void stuff, I hope they go hard on the hellscape aesthetics and tone. Give us clouds with innumerable eyes, walls of gnashing maws, and the ground a screaming carpet of faces.

[EmpyreanHelios]

I made it! I really liked that final credits image and always wanted one with my character in it for myself, but I had to remove those two eyesores first. Took a couple of months of poking but now it is correct.

Ohhh. It looks great! Good job on it! Those two being on it ruined the great wallpaper potential of the picture.

[KizuyaKatogami]

Why not? It could take an interesting turn and you wouldn't know.

Unlikely, at least for me. Unlikely. They’ve shown this patch they’re will to just handwave most stories that don’t involve the writers’ beloved scions. Garlemald’s entire story? Destroyed off screen and the garleans are just taken to the moon. Corvos? Second legion is gone there, died to the final days. Nerva who was built up for most of ShB? Killed off and turned into a blasphemy. 10/10 writing. At least we’ve seen the writing of the new “junior writers”, and have seen it isn’t an improvement from EW.

[Theodric]

All the characters I liked were killed off and I've never liked the Scions except for Estinien. The HW style of storytelling I enjoyed doesn't seem to be coming back. So what incentive do I really have to stay invested in the story? Being forced to travel with what I consider to be bland party members is pretty frustrating. So pretty much the moment one of them opens their mouth I'm like SKIP

I was always under the impression that a mature story acknowledged varied personal tastes. The developers certainly talk up the differences in perspective but at this point anyone who isn't fully aligned with the Scions is killed off, usually in a very undignified manner that ignores any positive aspects of their being. This isn't the game I enjoyed throughout ARR and HW and it's clearly only going to get worse from here on out.

Which sucks, but it is what it is - WoW went in the exact same direction. I could stick around for the PvE and PvP stuff but...to be honest, there's other options on the market that do both better from my perspective. I was excited about the new PvP mode but I can't queue for it with friends which killed my interest altogether - and I say that as one of the rare players who unironically enjoyed playing Frontlines.