Toxic DPS

[Absimiliard]

I have the privilege of one of my good friends being a healer, so if she sees a DPS trying that with me in content I don't want to pull wall to wall (for me, rare, but sometimes on DRK I'll just run out of cooldowns and decide to start DPS on a group before pulling more for MP/cd countdown, but even on DRK this is rare for me) we will rescue him into us and warn him not to do it again. If he does it again, I let him hold aggro and healer doesn't heal him. It's rare that I don't pull entire dungeons, so if I do there's usually a reason for it. Particular mob does extra damage, waiting on a key cooldown/resource, whatever it may be. If I am not with my partner in crime, I will politely ask them to let me pace the pulls, I may not trust the healer or something, and then I match their respect. I had a Reaper yelling at me in smileton because I couldn't keep up with him, which was a damn meme because he'd start running before pulls ere dead, use sprint, and dash forward all in one go to the next group. I was with my healer partner for this one, so when he did the same thing to aggro the boss, I just took my tank stance off, let him eat the tankbuster and die, then replaced my tank stance. It's one thing to pretend this game is a race (Like I see people in this thread doing) it's another thing to play in a way that requires other players to go beyond their levels of comfort. Just show them the respect they showed you.

An eye for an eye only blinds those that would blind you.

Trusts are an excellent option for people that are uncomfortable with playing the game at the level of the majority. Trying to force the dungeon to go at the pace you want it rather than the pace it's intended to be done at (note: wall to wall pulling is in fact what the game is designed around at this point) is in effect showing tremendous disrespect for the other participants in that dungeon.

[Undeadfire]

Trusts exist for people that are uncomfortable with playing the game at the level of the majority.

If Trusts AOE I would pick them any time over randoms, they do more DPS than a lot of randoms.

[Absimiliard]

At this point I am honestly beginning to agree with this mindset. Probably exactly why SE doesn't want them to AoE, I'd wager. We are at a point now where people are considering the use of sprint in dungeons hyper-optimized, tanks are fine with fighting 1-2 mobs at a time, healers think it's fine to do zero DPS, and DPS don't know what maintenance buffs are at all. Trusts legitimately perform better than an alarming percentage of the playerbase.

[Shurrikhan]

...I let him hold aggro and healer doesn't heal him....

An eye for an eye only blinds those that would blind you.

Well, that was quite the ironic way to end that post.


Yes, varying comfort levels are a thing, but let's not forget our context here: dozens of required dungeons into the story. If a player can't be bothered to learn how to tank by then, the least they can do is not gleefully PK their party out just to maintain some false sense of pride.

EDIT:

Of note, OP was asking how to deal with toxic players like that, so that's how I deal with them. I match their energy, that's all. Don't like it? Don't be it.

Alright, that makes sense, then. My apologies for connecting your response more to the recent posts than to the original intention of the thread.

[Ryaduera]

Well, that was quite the ironic way to end that post.


Yes, varying comfort levels are a thing, but let's not forget our context here: dozens of required dungeons into the story. If a player can't be bothered to learn how to tank by then, the least they can do is not gleefully PK their party out just to maintain some false sense of pride.

I fundamentally disagree with the sentiment of "Do not play the tank role if you are not going to tank to my standard" since that very statement oozes elitism which is a toxic and unhealthy way of playing a game that requires a community and entirely ignores the fact that GNB starts at 60 and that might be the tank of choice for some players, maybe they like guns and got to HW with a DPS, unlocked MCH and then GNB, but because they feel like enjoying something else, they shouldn't because they can't do it to the standard of the person that didn't even pick tank role. Some people aren't good at games... let them have fun even if it means taking it a little slow once in a while. Take away from my fun? I take away from your fun. Be polite and respectful? So will I.

Examples.
"Sorry, I was waiting for a couple cooldowns before pulling extras, I'll be doing full pulls when I have my abilities, just needed ~10s"

Response 1:
"Ok"
Response 2:
"My bad, I didn't mean to rush you."
Response 3:
"I don't care if you didn't have cooldowns, we can pull everything"

Response one is neutral and fine, from there just watch their behavior. No hard feelings, but they probably aren't enjoying their time, so I'll try to pick up the pace a little more.
Response two is polite and courteous, I would have nothing against this person.
Response three is terrible. I took aggro and handled it the first time, tried to communicate with them that I would rather have a slow and easy experience and they responded with demands. This is unacceptable and is essentially telling me they don't care if I have a good time or not, and so I will also choose to not care if they enjoy their time.

As a tank I haven't had this issue in a long time, but I have seen it before when I was a DPS or healer and no I did not enjoy going 1 group at a time, but I dealt with it because the tank was a good sport and I gave him some constructive criticism. The difference is demanding others bring themselves up to your standard to ruin their experience, or being patient and letting them have a good time and moving on to the next dungeon. Just... slow down and move on. Not everything is about you, such is the nature of multiplayer.

Of note, OP was asking how to deal with toxic players like that, so that's how I deal with them. I match their energy, that's all. Don't like it? Don't be it.

Trusts are an excellent option for people that are uncomfortable with playing the game at the level of the majority. Trying to force the dungeon to go at the pace you want it rather than the pace it's intended to be done at (note: wall to wall pulling is in fact what the game is designed around at this point) is in effect showing tremendous disrespect for the other participants in that dungeon.

"I won't have fun playing with you, so you shouldn't play with ANYBODY"

[Canadane]

Response 3:
"I don't care if you didn't have cooldowns, we can pull everything"

...

Response three is terrible.

It's actually really good advice, taken in a negative tone. You don't need multiple cooldowns on the ready. You generally cycle one after the other, and in some tanks cases you don't even touch them all even with a full wall-to-wall pull.

If you look at it more of a 'We can still do it, trust in yourself and your team' kinda way, they are encouraging you to continue without the need to wait for cooldowns, which as I said is how it's generally done so it's decent taking advice.

[Ryaduera]

It's actually really good advice, taken in a negative tone. You don't need multiple cooldowns on the ready. You generally cycle one after the other, and in some tanks cases you don't even touch them all even with a full wall-to-wall pull.

If you look at it more of a 'We can still do it, trust in yourself and your team' kinda way, they are encouraging you to continue without the need to wait for cooldowns, which as I said is how it's generally done so it's decent taking advice.

I know, but a newer player may not, and tone is what the problem actually is, that's my entire point. The message received is significantly more important than the message delivered. The issue at hand is attitude and toxicity, not tanking and managing cooldowns. You should not have a bad attitude just because someone isn't up to your standards, it's just that simple. Don't be a dick just because your comfort zone is beyond someone elses. See this line.

Of note, OP was asking how to deal with toxic players like that, so that's how I deal with them. I match their energy, that's all. Don't like it? Don't be it.

[Sacred-Oblivion]

If not, how do you tank mains go about dealing with it?

I switch to a single target rotation for the pull I'm currently tanking and wait for the DPS to die before picking up their pull.

[ForteNightshade]

At this point I am honestly beginning to agree with this mindset. Probably exactly why SE doesn't want them to AoE, I'd wager. We are at a point now where people are considering the use of sprint in dungeons hyper-optimized, tanks are fine with fighting 1-2 mobs at a time, healers think it's fine to do zero DPS, and DPS don't know what maintenance buffs are at all. Trusts legitimately perform better than an alarming percentage of the playerbase.

Oh, there is no doubt in my mind they programmed them not to AoE constantly because it'd basically make them better than the below average dredge you get in DF. Funny thing is, Urianger does AoE. I don't know if they forgot to alter his programing but holy hell, he's a complete monster in EW dungeons. I watched Xeno (and later tested myself) do Altiascope and Urianger pulled 12k on the first double pull you can do. Which was more than I could do. It's hilarious when Estinien and Y'shtola aren't even doing half that much.

[Absimiliard]

Extra points for Y'shtola being the black mage of the of the group. If any of them are going to pull off ridiculous AoE numbers, you'd think it would be the designated AoE bombardment job. But nope, Urianger for the win. He's great right up until he decides not to heal for a full 30 seconds and you're not playing literally any tank other than DRK.