Summoner feels really, really dumbed down now

[MellowMink]

Ifrit Ruin is just Ruin III.

Are they the same? No. Similar? Yes.

These are two contradicting statements; I replied to the first.

[Atamis]

These are two contradicting statements; I replied to the first.

to be fair hes not really wrong. Ifrits ability set is completely out of place as Ifrit doesn't cast anything except eruption and it isn't even themed correctly just being ruin but red. Arguing otherwise is just being pedantic.
2.8 cast time 2.5 recast 430 potency
1.5 cast time 2.5 recast 310 potency
Deals [damage] with a potency of [X]

one of these is ruin 3 one is ruby rite. No meaningful difference between them.

Ideally Ifrit would be rewarked to better match his trial abilities.

[RatCopter]

EW SMN is the only iteration I wanted to actually sit down and play in real content, and I unironically hope they do something similar to DRK.

My only complaints is
- casting on ifrit phase gives me whiplash after coming out of any other phase
- energy drain, aetherflow and fester feel like the relics of an age past that they are and could do with being expanded on in some way

Considering what Yoshi P said about HW DRK, you have my condolences if you're not happy with this SMN, because you probably won't get to go back.

[ty_taurus]

There's only so much that we can realistically expect of mid-expansion job changes, but with that in mind, here is my own personal take on what I'd do to improve SMN's experience over the course of EW besides just potency increases:

1. Adjust Garuda's phase so that Emerald Rite and Emerald Catastrophe have a 1.5 second cast time and up their power proportionally. This adds more casting back into SMN and also helps further identity the value of Titan's mobility, especially at lower levels.
2. Have Physick change into Shining Physick when changing from ACN to SMN: a GCD on a 90 second cooldown that restores 20% of the SMN's HP and MP that comes from your Carbuncle. Not a particularly exciting ability, but gives the Physick button a purpose, extra utility from Carbuncle which many of us want, and helps you get back on your feet after a raise. We could also just cut Physick, but I was trying to find excuses to give Carbuncle more. They won't do this, but I would.
3. Add a new ability at level 50 called Gemstone Light: an OGCD on a 60 second cooldown that comes from your Carbuncle and grants you a random gemstone and can only be used when you have none. Again, it gives a bit more to Carbuncle as our aid and gives SMN some much needed flexibility whenever you need to wait before your next Summon Bahamut/Phoenix, such as before a boss in a dungeon, when a phase change is about to come up, etc.
4. Have Energy Drain upgrade into Energy Siphon and just keep the damage of Energy Drain. SMN is in no concern of button bloat right now, but of all the "now you get an AoE version" buttons, this is one of the ones that feels really superfluous. This could also just be saved for 7.0 with the introduction of more new actions to warrant saving some hotbar space, but not everything needs a 1-to-1 AoE only button.
5. Restore ShB SMN's Fountain of Fire > Brand of Purgatory combo and spread that relationship to Astral Impulse > Astral Flare and Gemshine > Precious Brilliance. A 1-2 combo isn't really substantial depth, but it's something that could at least add a touch more substance to SMN's gameplay for the time being.

[Dahlinea]

Considering what Yoshi P said about HW DRK, you have my condolences if you're not happy with this SMN, because you probably won't get to go back.

No need to go back. Everyone pretty much knows it will stay with this kit. The job is already reworked. Of course, I still prefer the old job but gotta deal with it.
What we want is the SMN to have real job mechanics that make the new skills meaningful. Right now you just shoot them for damage and you can even ditch the summons and their whole set of skills if Bahamut/Phoenix is up again, typically in boss transitions, since Bahamut/Phoenix are still the (now standalone) SMN bursts.
Also the Attunement skills doesn't give a good flow during the fights. Some tweaks are much needed.

[Sequora]

No need to go back. Everyone pretty much knows it will stay with this kit. The job is already reworked. Of course, I still prefer the old job but gotta deal with it.
What we want is the SMN to have real job mechanics that make the new skills meaningful. Right now you just shoot them for damage and you can even ditch the summons and their whole set of skills if Bahamut/Phoenix is up again, typically in boss transitions, since Bahamut/Phoenix are still the (now standalone) SMN bursts.
Also the Attunement skills doesn't give a good flow during the fights. Some tweaks are much needed.

I think it was interesting that people bring up that some summon phases feel awkward in some fights. This is literally the one choice the new summoner gets to make. There are fights that I’ve learned that I have to change the order based on mechanics. If you need more movement save titan for that phase.

[Dahlinea]

I think it was interesting that people bring up that some summon phases feel awkward in some fights. This is literally the one choice the new summoner gets to make. There are fights that I’ve learned that I have to change the order based on mechanics. If you need more movement save titan for that phase.

Titan is actually the well-designed one of the 3. Garuda and Ifrit skills are the strange ones.
For me, it would make much more sense if Garuda hardcast ground DoT was OGCD and Emerald Rite were spells with fast casting times instead of instacasts. Ifrit's Ruby Rite having less cast time and Crimison Cyclone/Strike being two separate buttons sharing a 2 stack counter (so not a combo anymore and the possibility of repeating them), giving more flexibility.

But that's just my impressions from my play time with SMN till now.

[Imoen]

Ya, I don't think it needs to go back. It just needs more. I am disheartened that it's so "meh" tho. I really don't think summoner should be just going down a checklist of "yup titan, yup ruda, yup ifrit) I would have preferred... simply ideas...

-More summons (6 minimum outside of Demi)
-Decision making on the "Who, What, When, Where and Why." to summon.
-Some synergies or interactions between different summons abilities.
-Having energy drain be the trigger for the summoning of the non-demi versions, which stacks would be dumped upon demi summon to avoid holding.
-Distinctions between the summons (Maybe some offering small short buffs or utility, AOE masters and others are single target masters)
-An ability that augments fester depending on the summon we are currently attuned with. (Maybe Ruda, is an aoe master, that makes fester a painflare equiv for example applying windburn at a lesser potency, or ramuh making fester a single target that can interrupt... just an example.)
-a Pepsis type of effect where we can pop and give up something up to achieve something else if a situation requires it.
-1 less summon per cycle to allow room for more meaningful choice in what is being summoned, possibly rotation of light and dark flavored summons every other cycle or every cycle gets 1 dark 1 light summon. Idk
-A much more interesting/busy demi phase.

Honestly I don't know, I'm simply throwing things at the wall here, I don't get paid for this. I wish there was more decisions to make in the "Who, what, where, when and why?" of the actual summoning process. Instead of just running down the check list and asking "Is ifrit gonna do me dirty here?" I really don't care what the identity is as far as a more support driven dps with lower dps or a big dps oriented caster with less utility. I simply wish there was a bit more going on here.

[dinnertime]

These are two contradicting statements; I replied to the first.

You are honestly grasping at straws now.

Now answer what's so varied about them when their only purpose is being filler on your rotation for being the weakest part of your kit. Oh, and why you'd use Ruin III for weaving.

[Rolder50]

Really all it needs is a little something extra to keep track of, whether that be some kind of buff, a debuff for the target, an extra oGCD or three, anything.