Does SGE need potency buffs?

[OtakuSempai]

That'd be great, but I doubt they'll do it. Design direction seems to be "make sure anything but spamming one boring button over and over and over again is never the better choice". All of the healer damage alternatives to their boring nuke are either long cooldowns you use immediately, or always a damage loss.

Apply that flaming trash design onto a DPS class, see how fast the forums riot/the devs change it.

Basically this. Only changes I would want on SGE are literally anything that veers away from this.

Toxickon an ogcd with more ways to get it, pneuma on a short CD, phlegma not being clunky, etc.

[HyoMinPark]

Basically this. Only changes I would want on SGE are literally anything that veers away from this.

Toxickon an ogcd with more ways to get it, pneuma on a short CD, phlegma not being clunky, etc.

I’d prefer Phlegma as the oGCD since Toxikon is better as a movement tool being that it doesn’t have a melee requirement. Phlegma is kind of akin to WHM’s Assize, at least in terms of being a skill you just blow on cooldown. (And it’s the same durations as well.)

[Vatom]

I’d prefer Phlegma as the oGCD since Toxikon is better as a movement tool being that it doesn’t have a melee requirement. Phlegma is kind of akin to WHM’s Assize, at least in terms of being a skill you just blow on cooldown. (And it’s the same durations as well.)

Reason why I don't agree is because Phlegma has high dmg and just is CD with a melee caveat not a proc that cost 900MP and then requires another GCD

Just to say its take no effort to keep Phlegma rolling and have a big hit

BUT! I see what you mean as well with it kinda being the weave ability that you can do occasionally doesn't seem to be a bad idea
I was just looking at toxicon as that but a more frequent of weave that can line you up into another dosis keeping you rolling with a burst of dps and heals
making the cost be MP and the pay of is dmg

Though 45s weave seems more SE alley and probably would fit more but I worry they would nerf the dmg if they did

[HyoMinPark]

Reason why I don't agree is because Phlegma has high dmg and just is CD with a melee caveat not a proc that cost 900MP and then requires another GCD

Just to say its take no effort to keep Phlegma rolling and have a big hit

BUT! I see what you mean as well with it kinda being the weave ability that you can do occasionally doesn't seem to be a bad idea
I was just looking at toxicon as that but a more frequent of weave that can line you up into another dosis keeping you rolling with a burst of dps and heals
making the cost be MP and the pay of is dmg

Though 45s weave seems more SE alley and probably would fit more but I worry they would nerf the dmg if they did

I don’t think it takes any effort to keep it rolling—that’s not really what I’m talking about here. I’m talking more about when there are calls for movement and you are unable to be in melee range for Phlegma uses OR your Phlegma is on CD. While holding is an option, you still have to consider burst windows where Phlegma would be better used as opposed to holding. If Toxikon was switched to oGCD and Phlegma kept GCD, for any instance where you are having to disengage you won’t have that Toxikon for the re-engagement. You won’t be able to stay in melee range for disengage mechanics since melee DPS and tanks will always take priority. Icarus is an option, but it’s it’s higher CD there might be occasions where it’s not up. I’m thinking about P3S right now, and I know a lot are fight RNG, but we had several pulls tonight that was nothing but spread versus light party stacks. So there was an immense amount of movement where Toxikon was handy—and I wasn’t in range to use Phlegma during a lot of them.

If there is any time where you have to do any kind of movement outside of melee range, you will just have to take the L and lose casts if you no longer have Toxikon as an option to keep your GCD rolling.

That’s my main concern in Toxikon versus Phlegma being oGCD. Purely regarding heavy movement mechanics.

[Vatom]

I don’t think it takes any effort to keep it rolling—that’s not really what I’m talking about here. I’m talking more about when there are calls for movement and you are unable to be in melee range for Phlegma uses OR your Phlegma is on CD. While holding is an option, you still have to consider burst windows where Phlegma would be better used as opposed to holding. If Toxikon was switched to oGCD and Phlegma kept GCD, for any instance where you are having to disengage you won’t have that Toxikon for the re-engagement. You won’t be able to stay in melee range for disengage mechanics since melee DPS and tanks will always take priority. Icarus is an option, but it’s it’s higher CD there might be occasions where it’s not up. I’m thinking about P3S right now, and I know a lot are fight RNG, but we had several pulls tonight that was nothing but spread versus light party stacks. So there was an immense amount of movement where Toxikon was handy—and I wasn’t in range to use Phlegma during a lot of them.

If there is any time where you have to do any kind of movement outside of melee range, you will just have to take the L and lose casts if you no longer have Toxikon as an option to keep your GCD rolling.

That’s my main concern in Toxikon versus Phlegma being oGCD. Purely regarding heavy movement mechanics.

Sorry must of not been more clearer on the rolling. I was stating it was easy to keep it rolling MB

I had a mental note about movement but for some reason wasn't acknowledging it and for that I apologize
It does make a big difference and instead of giving you a fomo feel with toxicon while moving Phlegma would help reduce that feel
with its CD time also you could hold for burst phases and make the most of it
Yeah that 45s still suck for missing some windows but if you got a nin with you probably would feel too bad

I still thin SE would nerf it if they did go this route

[Heilstos]

ATM I like SGE in way it is.

So only thing that should be buffed is Icarus. 45s is so long can it BLM part that has only 10s.

But I am the Pnuema heal is something that has to finger out better. The heals come so fast out.

[AnotherPerson]

Only thing that really needs a buff is SGE's Icarus and Toxikon I (Toxikon II is okay at the moment). Either 2 charges or a lower cooldown on the gap closer will fix the issue of SGE having a really long cd on their gapcloser. Toxikon I is currently only used as a mobility tool with DPS loss, even in AoE because Dykrasia I is 160 potency whereas Toxikon I is 240 + 50% falloff AoE. You basically use Toxikon I with 2 targets (360 potency), and only 2 targets, which is a rare occurrence. Dosis does 300 potency. Dykrasia does 320 potency on 2 targets, and only does more on 3+. Thus, there is very little point in building Toxikon I up.

Toxikon II removes the issue of being a direct DPS loss since it's DPS Neutral with Dosis III (unless you're forcefully trying to develop stacks during combat instead of pre-pull and transitions).

SGE isn't meant to be a 1 to 1 duplicate of SCH. They're different jobs, so their skills have different caveats when working together. SGE has Taurochole + Addersgall regenerating every 20 seconds as opposed to SCH having Excogitation with a 3 aetherflow per 60 seconds. As the speed of resource generation differs, so does the order in which you cycle resources. Rizomata generates 1 addersgall, which can be spent for any addersgall skill - including SCH's Sacred Soil Equivalent. They can also use this ability to hold addersgall for a longer duration. SCH cannot, as Recitation will expire after a certain period of time. Instead they can force a crit on Succor/Adlo/Indomitability/Excog.

SCH has Dissipation, which works as a recovery tool when everything horribly wrong, or as a DPS tool. SGE has Soteria and overall stronger mitigation-to-healing in their regular healing rotation when stacking with your enhanced healing action buffs (Physis II and Krasis stacking together can superbuff your heals), which generally prevents them from ever reaching that scenario in the first place.

[Kabooa]

One change I would like for Toxikon is turning it into a 4 hit, 85 (340) potency spell, meaning it could cause Kardia to activate 4 times. Really sell that multiple hit aesthetic that's going on. This allows you to amp up your Kardia power when needed, adding another consideration to using it, and giving more reason to find places you can stock it up for minimal cost. It also gives you an emergency resource to spend if the tank starts eating dirt.

Regarding toxikon's actual power, I think Addersting needs more sources. Haima and Panhaima should each grant 1 per use, either when the effect expires completely or when a shield breaks / consumed.

Further in mind, Pepsis should also be able to consume Pan/Haima, 1 stack, to trigger its effect, as well as count for gaining Addersting.

These should be fairly tame but well rounded additions to the sage kit, IMO.

[Bsrking5]

The only buff i want is for icarus to have 2 charges and/or it to not a have cooldown outside of combat.

[Liam_Harper]

Toxicon being a GCD makes it a perfect movement tool, there just needs to be better or more ways to access it.

For example, allow Toxicon to be used with Addersgall and Addersting simply becomes "make your next Toxicon(s) free" stacks. Now you've got a useful Addersgall dump that's still dps neutral and doesn't discourage you from healing with it.

If that gives the class too much mobility, I like the idea of Haima and Panhaima triggering it. Rhizo should also generate a Sting. Should be plenty.