ToS policy violation examples regarding vulgarity within an FC needs to be discussed

[Haseno]

Wrong, it's their house and thus their rules. You can't just go into a art gallery and insult people and just drink alcohol there and start a rave. It's their house, their rules. Their decision to decide what speech they want in their house, same as it is your right to kick people you don't like out of your house or just don't let them in in the first place.

Dunno where this mentality comes from that people just can burst into others property and act like douchebags without any consequences. Just cause it is a virtual space doesn't mean it's a lawless Eldorado ready for you to trash.

While it's true it's their property, it's also a false equivalency. I don't pay them to police my speech. I pay them to facilitate a good game design, that fosters a good community. It's my job to self-regulate my interactions with people in the community. It's my job to disassociate with people I don't like, and when all else fails, it is my job to Blacklist people I cannot tolerate.

People seem to have this false idea that you just get to report anyone you dislike and silence your opposition without consequence.

[Ranaku]

While it's true it's their property, it's also a false equivalency. I don't pay them to police my speech. I pay them to facilitate a good game design, that fosters a good community. It's my job to self-regulate my interactions with people in the community. It's my job to disassociate with people I don't like, and when all else fails, it is my job to Blacklist people I cannot tolerate.

People seem to have this false idea that you just get to report anyone you dislike and silence your opposition without consequence.

You pay them to interact with their property under their rules. Same as you would pay a entrance fee to look at art in an art gallery. That doesn't mean you can burst in there and trash the place and draw with a marker over the art they show. You pay them to get access to their service and they made clear if you don't respect the rules of their house they don't need your money, which is really really nice in my opinion.

So yeah, good riddance as i said. Since they have their rules, you in fact pay them to police your speech indeed. You may not like it but it is that way and even as we speak you pay them to do exactly that, if you like it or not. And if you don't, you know where the door is!

[Haseno]

You pay them to interact with their property under their rules. Same as you would pay a entrance fee to look at art in an art gallery. That doesn't mean you can burst in there and trash the place and draw with a marker over the art they show. You pay them to get access to their service and they made clear if you don't respect the rules of their house they don't need your money, which is really really nice in my opinion.

So yeah, good riddance as i said. Since they have their rules, you in fact pay them to police your speech indeed. You may not like it but it is that way and even as we speak you pay them to do exactly that, if you like it or not. And if you don't, you know where the door is!

I go by my own rules. I bend the knee to no one. The people who defend censorship are never the good guys. Never once.

[Ranaku]

I go by my own rules. I bend the knee to no one. The people who defend censorship are never the good guys. Never once.

I mean you did bend your knee to SE rules tho, right? Otherwise you violated the contract you have with them and they might show you where the exit is~

I mean you have your freedom of speech, you can say whatever you want, probably. Just not whereever your want.

[Vahlnir]

I go by my own rules. I bend the knee to no one.

I'd say that isn't necessarily a bad quality to have in general. However, that doesn't work quite as well in modern times as it did in medieval Europe. There's a time and place for it. Pick your battles wisely, sir. Various establishments, businesses and corporations all have their own rules that they have put in place for themselves to keep things running smoothly. As others and even myself have said, there's the door. Feel free to use it if this isn't to your liking. You're gonna have a rough time going through life like this if this is your approach to literally everything else. Good luck grabbing a drink at a local pub or buying a product at a store. Actually, good luck trying to do anything at all. I'm being sincere in wishing you this. Truly.

[Haseno]

I mean you did bend your knee to SE rules tho, right? Otherwise you violated the contract you have with them and they might show you where the exit is~

I mean you have your freedom of speech, you can say whatever you want, probably. Just not whereever your want.

Of course I haven't. You can't seem to comprehend that the TOS doesn't influence my behavior, nor will I change my behavior to appease the TOS. I'm not a "rude behavior" individual in-game. But make no mistake, that is because that is my natural personality. It has nothing to do with the rules of SE. If their rules become intolerable, then they'll be broken. The same way as laws, if a law is intolerable, I'll break it. If the law is tolerable, I didn't need it to begin with.

It's not a matter of if they impose rules, the question is if the rules should be in place. And I disagree they should.

[Ranaku]

I'd say that isn't necessarily a bad quality to have in general. However, that doesn't work quite as well in modern times as it did in medieval Europe. There's a time and place for it. Pick your battles wisely, sir. Various establishments, businesses and corporations all have their own rules that they have put in place for themselves to keep things running smoothly. As others and even myself have said, there's the door. Feel free to use it if this isn't to your liking. You're gonna have a rough time going through life like this if this is your approach to literally everything else. Good luck grabbing a drink at a local pub or buying a product at a store. Actually, good luck trying to do anything at all. I'm being sincere in wishing you this. Truly.

Just a kinda bad quality to have if you ever want a traditional engagement. Though i have to admit it's kinda funny to imagine that the fella just throws the ring to the ground and screams at his SO that he will never bend the knee. Maybe the fella is just really really progressive.

[Vahlnir]

Though i have to admit it's kinda funny to imagine that the fella just throws the ring to the ground and screams at his SO that he will never bend the knee. Maybe the fella is just really really progressive.

Honestly? This wouldn't surprise me at all. Very little does nowadays. I feel like I've seen it all over the last couple of years.

[Iscah]

Wrong, it's their house and thus their rules.

While that's definitely true for public interactions in the game, FCs are a different situation and I do think the way they've described the rules needs more scrutiny and, at very least, more clarification.

If you stick with the house analogy, FC chat is like the house owner saying "I don't want to hear anyone swearing in my house – but you can use this room for private conversation and if you swear in there, it's okay. But only as long as everyone in the room is fine with it. If one person comes in and doesn't like what they're hearing, I'm kicking you out."

If that's the rule, why allow swearing at all?

Alternately, if it's fine to swear inside the private room, why put the fault on the people who were okay with it (and were told the owner is okay with it) and not the one person who didn't like it and could have just removed themself from the situation?

In reality the applications of the rules might be more nuanced, not to mention the social implications for anyone trying to report an FC member like that for a minor infraction, but the example isn't clear and does sound like it's set up to allow one person to expect the culture of a group to change to suit them rather than finding another group that suits them better.

[Vahlnir]

While that's definitely true for public interactions in the game, FCs are a different situation and I do think the way they've described the rules needs more scrutiny and, at very least, more clarification.

If you stick with the house analogy, FC chat is like the house owner saying "I don't want to hear anyone swearing in my house – but you can use this room for private conversation and if you swear in there, it's okay. But only as long as everyone in the room is fine with it. If one person comes in and doesn't like what they're hearing, I'm kicking you out."

If that's the rule, why allow swearing at all?

Alternately, if it's fine to swear inside the private room, why put the fault on the people who were okay with it and not the one person who didn't like it and could have just removed themself from the situation?

In reality the applications of the rules might be more nuanced, not to mention the social implications for anyone trying to report an FC member like that for a minor infraction, but the example isn't clear and does sound like it's set up to allow one person to expect the culture of a group to change to suit them rather than finding another group that suits them better.

Yeah, I can see how this might be a bit problematic. Honestly, I didn't look at it this way. Hopefully they provide some clarification on this. If it works exactly as written, FCs are gonna have to be extremely careful who they bring in.