Gath ponders on "Master" crafting.

[darkstarpoet1]

SE already did the same thing in FFXI. You could level every craft to 60 but you could only take 1 to 100.

yes, they did, but that game was based and promoted as such. this game was made and promoted as being able to do anything on a single character if you are willing to put the time in to do so.

[Mireille]

I agree this this statement. I want to be able to do everything, even if it takes me a long time. Thats one of the draws of FF14. If I cannot then I should be able to have more characters so that I can have some specialize in some things while others specialize in something else.

When the game was initially designed the idea was you can level all jobs, but attribute point allotment was done once for all classes. You could allot your points evenly and be a generalist, or max the stats needed for 1 class and specialize in that class. The idea itself was good, but the execution of that idea was problematic. Maxing out miner would make you a bad mage, and that was sort of dumb.

Now each job gets its own points so there is no real specialization, and in the long run this will make the game /meh. Once everyone has the same gear/materia no one shines. Ultimately SE will have to address this through other aspects of the game or it won't be very fun because shining in MMOs is the most fun you can have playing one.

[Arcell]

When the game was initially designed the idea was you can level all jobs, but attribute point allotment was done once for all classes. You could allot your points evenly and be a generalist, or max the stats needed for 1 class and specialize in that class. The idea itself was good, but the execution of that idea was problematic. Maxing out miner would make you a bad mage, and that was sort of dumb.

Now each job gets its own points so there is no real specialization, and in the long run this will make the game /meh. Once everyone has the same gear/materia no one shines. Ultimately SE will have to address this through other aspects of the game or it won't be very fun because shining in MMOs is the most fun you can have playing one.

All your opinions of what fun is. I would have more fun in this game, and more to work towards, if my choice in crafting class isn't restricted past a certain point. I would much prefer being able to do everything on a single character, especially when additional characters are $3 per month each.

[darkstarpoet1]

All your opinions of what fun is. I would have more fun in this game, and more to work towards, if my choice in crafting class isn't restricted past a certain point. I would much prefer being able to do everything on a single character, especially when additional characters are $3 per month each.

at times i wonder if people forget this aspect of a game. it is a game and a game is meant to be fun. if anyone can state a reason me taking the time to level each crafting class ruins their fun or how limiting how many classes i can level would increase my fun then they may have a point. their opinion is that is should be done this way just because it has been done that way before and not how doing things that way in a game will make things more fun.

[Madruk]

It doesn't have much to do with fun as it does with making a working economy. But like I mentioned prior, there are other ways to limit items coming into the game that doesn't take specializing.

[ToxicFox]

I kinda agree with Gath for once... I agree that not being able to have every craft at max would kinda suck but having everyone with every craft at max sucks more. Perhaps we can get the best of both worlds. Lets take a lesson from how they're doing jobs. Perhaps the "master job" would allow us to make weapons and armor but if we didn't have it we couldn't. We could still level it to max but it would be harder to do and not as rewarding. We could even have it so we can do a quest to change our "master craft". The quest could even be a nice gil sink for SE. This also would allow us to repair and meld items that are above 50 with our "sub crafts"

[darkstarpoet1]

It doesn't have much to do with fun as it does with making a working economy. But like I mentioned prior, there are other ways to limit items coming into the game that doesn't take specializing.

if you want to go towards a working economy instead of what we have now the first thing that needs to happen is not having every new piece of gear and every viable weapon in the game(minus mages) coming as drops. you want an economy to come back in a top heavy game then you need to bring out more crafted items that are used for situational gear. the problem is only a very small amount of gear is even worth making because of how top heavy the servers are with all classes capped.

you introduce more nm's like we had with the buffalo and dodore that drops materials for good gear to be made out of it and more different types of items that are used in situational fights then you revive the economy. the reason the economy is dead is not because of too many crafters at capped. the problem is most people are already capped on the classes they want to be and have the gear they want for it.

you could also add mobs that drop a piece of rare materials that you can take and upgrade a piece of unique gear to a nicer piece of unique gear. say that old piece of gear that is now worthless upgrades to another body piece if you add a piece from a new nm that is put in place and the new one is an upgrade for body that is good for a situational fight. it makes multiple pieces of content that was worthless viable again and puts new items into the wards that are sought after.

why is selling low level weapons dead?
people go from 1-30 in a very short time so they have no need to upgrade their gear. there is also such a low amount of people coming into the game that there is no demand for that gear.

why is selling mid level weapons dead?
the best weapons for mid levels are premade drops off the mini nm's so why would anyone pay even 10k for a weapon that is lower quality than one they can get for free from a mob. those weapons cannot attach materia because they are u/u so once someone gets 1 there is no chance to blow it up and need another.

why is selling high level weapons dead?
between the weapons that are dropped from ifrit, moogle, and coffers there is only a very small percentage of crafted gear that even has a need to be made. outside of the wand of tides and the lightning brand there is no other weapon that is even comparable to the ifrti weapons.

why is selling low level gear dead?
once again the speed of leveling people are past these before they are even ready to upgrade.

why is selling mid level gear dead?
once again it goes to people can get better gear from drops off the mini nm's than they can crafted gear. if someone can get something for free why would they buy anything?

why is selling high level gear dead?
this is the only thing that people are able to make and sell. the problem is the prices for the materials add up to a point where you are lucky to break even selling the gear much less make a profit at all.

no matter if they limit crafters from going beyond 50 or not the economy is still stuck at that point because of the same reasons. no matter if there's 50 crafters that can make an item or 5000 it doesn't matter. if the items don't sell then the situation doesn't change.

[Rokien]

Yaaa, having max crafters is OP. Gaths gil would be even more >.>

[Gath]

Yaaa, having max crafters is OP. Gaths gil would be even more >.>

Gath's gil is ever increasing.

Gath's 1 gil is worth more than your 1 gil.

[Mireille]

yes, they did, but that game was based and promoted as such. this game was made and promoted as being able to do anything on a single character if you are willing to put the time in to do so.

The game as it was originally promoted was rejected and is being redesigned by a team with their own creative vision. Everything we liked about 1.0 won't make it to 2.0 and that's just the way of it. The system in question was also designed to use physical levels and common stat distribution amongst all the classes and disciplines. They also had surplus and fatigue and now all of that is gone and in some cases was replaced by new systems that do similar things in a different way.

All your opinions of what fun is. I would have more fun in this game, and more to work towards, if my choice in crafting class isn't restricted past a certain point. I would much prefer being able to do everything on a single character, especially when additional characters are $3 per month each.

Specialization doesn't mean you can't level all crafts to cap. Its more like making a career choice once you have developed basic job skills. As to my point about fun I know 100% of the people don't agree with me, and I never expected them to. Given the feedback I have seen on the forums I can say one of the loudest complaints I have seen echoed over the past year is the grindfest with nothing to do at the end. Some people like grinding and leveling so much they have more than one toon, but I'll wager that a majority of people would rather be known as the best tank, or dd, or magic dd, or goldsmith, etc on the server than 1 of 10000 people with all jobs at cap. Exping isn't the end of fun in MMOs its the beginning of it. If Yoshida didn't think that he wouldn't be so gung ho on making leveling easy, so people can get cap and do stuff with their friends.