Normal Raids aren't exactly Raids, are they?

[ReiganCross]

In regards to challenging trash... non of your examples is challenging.

Yeah, I said they tried. The best example I can think of is what they did on that room after the first pair of bosses in CLL, and that's also not a challenge.

But it's an attempt. It means they haven't (nor shouldn't) give up. My only point in pointing those out is saying that there's still a place for them.

And somehow I don't get tired of doing the trashpulls in Alexanders, and while I was on the HW Endgame (Which I spent a month on.) And they weren't even challenging, people just breeze past those parts, doesn't mean the fight is worthless.

[Vidu]

Yeah, I said they tried. The best example I can think of is what they did on that room after the first pair of bosses in CLL, and that's also not a challenge.

But it's an attempt. It means they haven't (nor shouldn't) give up. My only point in pointing those out is saying that there's still a place for them.

And somehow I don't get tired of doing the trashpulls in Alexanders, and while I was on the HW Endgame (Which I spent a month on.) And they weren't even challenging, people just breeze past those parts, doesn't mean the fight is worthless.

(Uni over for today, time for the second post here...)

I dont think that making the trash more challenging would be the answer by itself - they need to make these fights somehwat more engaging, to make them feel like a valid part of the overall experience (even on run 50), not like a hinderance. As I mentioned in my previous post: For me, the bossfight of a raid is the intresting part, the part where progress happens and the part you want to get to - anything on the way is amazing the first time, nice the second time, okay-ish the third time and just a drag past run 30.

Making it more challenging would only make it more of a hinderance, not necessarly more intresting.
They'd need to ask "How can we make sure that this adds to the overall experience of the content?" - so the question would also be "What do we - or the playerbase - want the overall experience of this content to be like?"

For me, trash doesnt add much to the experience of the raid content after the first few rounds. It wouldnt add much if it would be more difficult, since there isnt any benefit to gain from it anymore - I got all the lore and exploring in Omega with the solo-duties, I havent really lost that experience of the first runs, I just dont have to go through it again and again.
So that would be one way for me - to have them in solo-duties. They could also go down the route of T2 and give you certain benefits during the fight at the end if you defeat certain mobs before.

Bottomline is: I dont think adding trash just "to have it" is the way to go. It has to be tied to the gameplay aspect of the content, it has to be something intresting and something people would actually want to do - currently thats not it and has never really been it.
They'd have to find a way to make sure that those trash fights add something to the content - not only on day one where it obviously adds story, atmosphere and lore - but also on day 50.