Are the numbers too high?

[Roaran]

you are also forgetting there are in fact stat caps for example lnc str caps at 290 and pie caps at 280 there has been testing on this in the archer and lancer section in this forum i can post links if people want

I'm a bit skeptical of this, but my testing has only been on my marauder, and I haven't tested vitality's effect on damage yet. This may also explain though why people feel gear isn't particularly useful.

Having stat caps is a poor decision from a design perspective; I don't see why they would implement something like a materia system, and then make much of the harder to obtain melds obsolete.

[Akira]

yea only arc and lnc have been tested so far that i know so

[Rydin]

Tons of posts while I was away....

@Kaeko fine... no more line by line arguments... I'll just ask this: Are you happy with the way the stats are working? in terms of boosts from gear and materia?

@Roaran... You said adding 30 STR will see no difference but adding 30 attack and 100+ Str will show "great differences." This thread makes 2 points and that addresses one of them. In your example... 30 str is fruitless so +3 Str gloves are worse than pointless?
Thats all I'm saying...
At some point Attributes and stats got supercharged... but the bonus received from gear stayed relatively low
The second point I'm making is that You can hit something in just your weapon and then hit the same thing fully geared with Materia... and the difference is just not that great... and thats imbalanced

you are also forgetting there are in fact stat caps for example lnc str caps at 290 and pie caps at 280 there has been testing on this in the archer and lancer section in this forum i can post links if people want

That just magnifies my point... My lancer has 256 Str without ANY gear on.... I saw the test for Lancer stats and honestly I was relatively satisfied that the testing methodology and results were valid
No one sees that as an issue that Str is 256 without any gear and caps at 290?

@Jinko I wasn't saying it was necessarily confusing... I was just saying that every gain... even a linear gain... is percentage based. The percentage just changes every time the MOB changes... or rather the MOBs stats change
What I mean by that is... If the only MOB in the game was a Level 50 Amal'jaa Drubber then you would only be concerned with percentages at that point.
Increase X state by Y amount for a Z% increase in damage. Im saying it is human nature, not to be confused, but to break everything down to percentages, and evaluate how worthwhile the change is based off of the percentage increase.
Thats how our minds work. Any increase that shows less than a 1% increase in damage on target MOBs at or above your level is considered worthless. SE is slowly giving us a reason to not "Gear up"

[Elexia]

Attributes and stat enhancements aren't useless, been plenty of testing that has proven this. Every game in existence that has an attribute system has a cap on stats in various factors, either:

1. At "Level 40" your STR will have a stat cap of +80 then you will notice diminishing returns beyond that because for the level, it's balanced around only a boost of around +80, so if you have 38 base STR +80 and you gain 300 additional damage to your skills, that's as high as the damage will go ignoring specific mob weaknesses.

Then you have the fact as you level the cap raises and the diminishing return cap raises as well.

or

2. You have an overall stat cap of +999 which the damage itself scales with and how you layout your skills (if a talent tree exists.)

The problem with XIV, is the base stats are way too high and not necissarily done so "for the future" because FFXI for example only has base stats of iirc 87 ignoring stat merits and the current cap is now 99, 10 years later, but every +10 stat you add gives you a noticable increase because the base stats are low, but in XIV, even with over +100 of a stat, you still barely notice an increase at times.

So the problem is not that a cap exist (every MMO in particular has stat and damage caps) its the fact they're all over the place if you do actual testing you realize this fairly quickly.

[lucas_b]

The problem with XIV, is the base stats are way too high and not necissarily done so "for the future" because FFXI for example only has base stats of iirc 87 ignoring stat merits and the current cap is now 99, 10 years later, but every +10 stat you add gives you a noticable increase because the base stats are low, but in XIV, even with over +100 of a stat, you still barely notice an increase at times.

So the problem is not that a cap exist (every MMO in particular has stat and damage caps) its the fact they're all over the place if you do actual testing you realize this fairly quickly.

Yep exactly that, base stats too high and armor stats too low.

[Kaeko]

@Kaeko fine... no more line by line arguments... I'll just ask this: Are you happy with the way the stats are working? in terms of boosts from gear and materia?

I think for now I'll back down and go with the "agree to disagree" cop-out with regards to our short back and forth earlier. I do think that as more testing gets posted (takes forever to write formal posts) and it trickles through the community, the arguments will be more refined. I think say in 6 months (nearing 2.0), there's a good chance we would have this same back and forth because we still disagree, but the arguments themselves will be so much more meaningful.

I do think on a global level, the way it works is ok (as are the gains). There are specific tweeks to certain stats that I would make suggestions to; however, it's best to wait for all the testing to come out openly so that we can all talk using real numbers as opposed to theorycraft. Right now so many theories are flying around - it's best just to let time filter out all the wrong ideas.

It's like we have to stand up before we can learn to walk - we have to know and AGREE on how stats work before we can complain about how they are broken.

[Rydin]

I think for now I'll back down and go with the "agree to disagree" cop-out with regards to our short back and forth earlier. I do think that as more testing gets posted (takes forever to write formal posts) and it trickles through the community, the arguments will be more refined. I think say in 6 months (nearing 2.0), there's a good chance we would have this same back and forth because we still disagree, but the arguments themselves will be so much more meaningful.

I do think on a global level, the way it works is ok (as are the gains). There are specific tweeks to certain stats that I would make suggestions to; however, it's best to wait for all the testing to come out openly so that we can all talk using real numbers as opposed to theorycraft. Right now so many theories are flying around - it's best just to let time filter out all the wrong ideas.

It's like we have to stand up before we can learn to walk - we have to know and AGREE on how stats work before we can complain about how they are broken.

I agree on that

[Roaran]

As far as stat capping goes, I just tested from 289 STR to 232, there was a shift of about 4% in the min-max range of damage, and a 2% increase in the average. So it does seem, after a certain point, the increasing gains either stop completely or cap out.

Which would mean stats beyond that point are pointless or not worth the cost.

[Rydin]

I don't like to call mechanics broken because it's a blanket term used to describe anything that you don't necessarily like... even if that mechanic is working as intended.
It is reasonable to suggest that this is how Yoshi-P envisioned gear and stats to work. And if that's the case... I'll get used to it eventually.
I really dont care for it though

[Jinko]

Seems like they were either heavily influenced by Tanaka's teams calculations or they just couldn't alter it enough without breaking the game.

Yea the stats make a bigger difference than before but not as much as most of us were hoping.

Can only hope they will re-evaluate the stats in 2.0.