Where is your personal sacrifice threshold?

[AC9Breaker]

I'm pretty much fine with most things. I feel like I waste more energy being passive aggressive then baby sitting with heals. If we wipe at a boss multiple times cause we can't do mechanics, then that's when I bail and take my 30 minute penalty. On alliance raids, if someone dies constantly, I'm likely to stop raising them mid battle, that's about it.

[Darkmoonrise]

I always raise people (except specific cases, for instance, when they did not accept the previous raise). Why? Because they don't get away with doing nothing and getting the reward. I'm doing my best but I'm not doing their job. If raising people again and again drains out all my MP and I cannot heal anymore, well too bad, hope they do better next time so I can keep healing.

I tend to have the same idea than some people here, with a list of positive and negative behaviour, but my "punishment" is not "stay dead", it's "get kicked". Thus, because my punishment is more extreme, my threshold is higher as well. You really need to put zero effort in to get the kick.

And about the original question, aka when do you say : "I f*** up as a healer". Rule of thumb when they die in more than 1 hit. I hate the "healer adjust" sentence but I agree with it, it's my job to deal with such bad behaviour. But I have to admit that I tend to f*** up intensionnaly from time to time. "You were greedy for the 3rd time in a row? Let put you at the bottom of the aggro list", "You are again 2000km away from me during an intensive healing part? let's see how long you can stand out there alone". "You ate this mechanic for the 4th time? That probably means you don't need those 60k HP. Let see if the remaing one are enough for the next raid wide aoe".

[Almagnus1]

I always raise people (except specific cases, for instance, when they did not accept the previous raise). Why? Because they don't get away with doing nothing and getting the reward. I'm doing my best but I'm not doing their job. If raising people again and again drains out all my MP and I cannot heal anymore, well too bad, hope they do better next time so I can keep healing.

I tend to have the same idea than some people here, with a list of positive and negative behaviour, but my "punishment" is not "stay dead", it's "get kicked". Thus, because my punishment is more extreme, my threshold is higher as well. You really need to put zero effort in to get the kick.

And about the original question, aka when do you say : "I f*** up as a healer". Rule of thumb when they die in more than 1 hit. I hate the "healer adjust" sentence but I agree with it, it's my job to deal with such bad behaviour. But I have to admit that I tend to f*** up intensionnaly from time to time. "You were greedy for the 3rd time in a row? Let put you at the bottom of the aggro list", "You are again 2000km away from me during an intensive healing part? let's see how long you can stand out there alone". "You ate this mechanic for the 4th time? That probably means you don't need those 60k HP. Let see if the remaing one are enough for the next raid wide aoe".

You do realize that those that are saying "healer adjust" are the same problems that don't want to admit they screwed up and would rather blame the healer for their failures, right?

[Deceptus]

In 90% of the content in this game I have two choices:

Mindlessly smash glare for the best part of 5-10 minutes straight

Or

Try to keep some scrub alive as they eat vuln stacks like candy.

One is at least as engaging as it is disappointing.

Eyyyyy, haven't seen you around these parts in a bit. Welcome back!

[Darkmoonrise]

You do realize that those that are saying "healer adjust" are the same problems that don't want to admit they screwed up and would rather blame the healer for their failures, right?

I do. But I don't care what they think, I do not take bad player as a model.

Everybody may screw up. Too sleepy, too much stuff going around IRL, bad mood, cat walking on the keyboard, what ever. As long as it's not again and again and again, I'm ready to adjust. If it's the 4th time then I let them die as a warning. Which makes the "I didn't screw up" guy even more angry. The cherry on top is raising them with a pocking macro, what a joy to see their reaction.

[Almagnus1]

I do. But I don't care what they think, I do not take bad player as a model.

Everybody may screw up. Too sleepy, too much stuff going around IRL, bad mood, cat walking on the keyboard, what ever. As long as it's not again and again and again, I'm ready to adjust. If it's the 4th time then I let them die as a warning. Which makes the "I didn't screw up" guy even more angry. The cherry on top is raising them with a pocking macro, what a joy to see their reaction.

I think what this thread is really getting at isn't the person that got hyperfocus and murdered by the mechanics (which is how I've been killed more than I really want to admit to), or had some other RL thing and ended up getting killed... it's the person that's dying over and over and over and isn't asking questions, never said their new to the instance, and will often blame everyone else for their failings.

Those people deserve to be kicked off the path in World of Darkness and lost to the void. They are the ones that I'm looking at going "you are lucky that I'm mostly AoE healing the party because you ARE NOT worth my single target heals". Those are the ones that I will leave dead because having to hard cast rez on them the second or third (or fourth or fifth) time in a fight means that I'm spending way more time (and mana) on them than they really deserve. Those are the people we are talking about in this thread, not the noobs that learn or the unlucky.

[Ultaniku]

I’ve played and mained heals for the entire lifespan of this game, mostly scholar, and I’ve hit all ends of the healer spectrum. From being a martyr to being vindictive and now I feel like I’ve found my happy medium. I typically will give people benefit of the doubt with a few deaths, mishaps, etc but that also doesn’t mean I won’t start keeping an eye on said person to see if it’s purposeful. If it becomes apparent that you are blatantly being that way because you know I’ll heal you....then I will. But I will do so so fleetingly you’ll think I’d forgotten you til your health is JUST about gone.
I forgive accidents and am more than willing to help with explanations of mechanics, but don’t take advantage of that kindness. By not participating and doing what you need to do makes what I have to do harder and that isn’t very nice.

[Quintessa]

I don't think I have a personal threshold. I will raise you til I can't do it anymore MP wise. As I said in another thread though: I'm not a 'carry' healer. If you stand in bad purposely, I will heal you but don't expect me to be there all the time. If I'm tending to me, the tank or someone else and you're stand there with vuln stacks and in an AOE, chances are you will die because I'll be late with a heal. All DPS should consider this when having that "healer adjust" mentality: Death is the biggest hit to your overall DPS than missing a few burst windows.

[Atmaweapon510]

There's a lot of rage in this thread.

I've never personally experienced that threshold. The only time I don't res is when I know that person is afk and won't accept and when I don't have enough resources at the moment. I don't know what all you people are encountering but no one is purposefully that bad and there are plenty of mechanics that aren't telegraphed well for a first time through.

What I *do* know from playing dps in alliance raids is that a lot of second time deaths is from healers who have no concept of triage and don't bother healing people they've just raised.

[Almagnus1]

As a counterpoint to this... sometimes you just need to do what you have to do to prevent a raid wipe... even if it means sucking it up and chainrezzing and healing another group. For example, last night in Puppet's Bunker at the Superior Flight Unit trio fight, one of the tanks in another group DC'd in the fight and it took out almost all of the remaining group. I figured my co-healer would be able to carry the healing in our group, so ran over, started rezzing and healing the group until the healers were able to carry the load again. The rest of the raid focused on taking out the two units with a full group then focused in on the last one. Not fun, but sometimes you just gotta do what you gotta do to beat the encounter.

That said, there was another group fight where one of the DPS was trash-talking the co-healer because they weren't doing whatever the DPS thought they should do, then proceeded to initiate a group kick against my co-healer... which thankfully failed. Needless to say, when we got to the final boss and that loudmouthed DPS got murdered by the mechanics, both myself and the co-healer left them dead. I know it's petty... but don't piss off your healers.