How could you do this to AST?

[ZedxKayn]

I seem to heal tanks way better in noct than dirunal as dirunal to me do not tic fast enough even if i aspected helios/aspected bene and cu which is 3 regens it still dont seem enough specially on a tank with poor gear, I really kill my mp more in dirunal than noct lol regens are claim stronger but to me they last so short it seem am just better off spamming aspected benefic noct and benefic 1 which is way more effiecient at keeping tank heal up or maybe a couple bene 2 , back then when regens was 30 second dirunal was more respectable for me now this mere 15 second mess by time i apply aspected bene/helios then apply the other, the other one just seem to already be finished. with darkness night on drk and my aspected bene that crits tons loving that 4k crit of mine. I have time to throw gravities then while all those fat 0s are just poping.

Might not be using AST's kit properly then. In a single target situation, helios, aspected or not, is a waste of MP over bene 2, for starters

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

I guess my point overall is, what exactly changes about your playstyle when in Nocturnal vs Diurnal? Did it change how you used your cards? Did it change how you contributed to DPS? Did it even change when you used certain healing actions, really? Maybe if Aspected Benefic was exclusively a barrier and didn't actually restore HP, then you could argue it forced you to heal preemptively. People say that about Aspected Benefic and Adloquium now, but the thing is that's not really efficient. If your party has max HP, then preemptively casting a barrier would also be overhealing, which is wasteful. Any time where your party is injured, then the barrier is virtually the same as the added healing you'd have received from a Benefic II.

Pretty sure it will only change some priority in usage of the Aspected healings, but let’s take a look on each of their affected healing kits:
- [Aspected Benefic/Helios]: when the situation calls for a healing spell, these two immediately comes to mind regardless of the sects. What comes after the first cast however depends. For diurnal sect, it is definitely discouraged to spam only these as regen ticks needs to be left alone to do their magic—overwriting them is an equal to loss. Nocturnal sect however differ slightly in a way that it has some preemptive use advantages & spammable when faced againtrepetitive incoming damage that constantly breaks the shield. Otherwise if needed, a regular [Benefic II/Helios] after the aspected (both sects) is generally way to go.
- [Collective Unconsciousness]: It’s very possible to weave in unchanneled dome for either free aoe regen (Diurnal) or free damage reduction (Nocturnal). Diurnal has a slight advantage over nocturnal due to how the game uses server tick to determine how long the 2nd buff lasts. This makes it possible for Diurnal user to slightly mitigate incoming damage while also leaving a lingering regen on whoever’s in the range.
- [Celestial Opposition]: used the same way as the aspected healing spells but always get prioritized first due to being an ability.
- [Celestial Intersection]: there’s almost no reason to let this ability sits regardless of sect. Keep it on cooldown, it’s basically a free benison or regen. And they’re not pushover neither.

Having the stances does creates an illusion of having the choice of playstyle, but we’re basically just switching tools around... so no, especially when what we’re using remains pretty much unchanged almost entire time (includes how we DPS, cards usage, etc).

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

I seem to heal tanks way better in noct than dirunal as dirunal to me do not tic fast enough even if i aspected helios/aspected bene and cu which is 3 regens it still dont seem enough specially on a tank with poor gear, I really kill my mp more in dirunal than noct lol regens are claim stronger but to me they last so short it seem am just better off spamming aspected benefic noct and benefic 1 which is way more effiecient at keeping tank heal up or maybe a couple bene 2 , back then when regens was 30 second dirunal was more respectable for me now this mere 15 second mess by time i apply aspected bene/helios then apply the other, the other one just seem to already be finished. with darkness night on drk and my aspected bene that crits tons loving that 4k crit of mine. I have time to throw gravities then while all those fat 0s are just poping.

Look, I bolded your own words there—that’s your possible answer to ‘why noct feels more powerful than dirunal’-question.
A lot players has already stated that ”shields are great for prog runs”. The same logic may also be applied to healing an undergeared/poor tanks. Why? Because during progs it is quite common for tanks/the party still fumbling awkwardly with their mitigation planning. This is where shielding becomes more useful, but not necessary. It loosens the margin of error into wiping. In dungeon pulls, the reason to stack regen is not exactly to heal the tanks to full (Yes. Because regen does NOTHING if they’re at full health. Let it do their ticks, duh). It’s to slow down the rate which your tank’s HP plummets before you need to pitch in an [Essential Dignity] or other stuff, and this can be affected by several different factors, not just the healers’ kits.

[IceBlueNinja]

Might not be using AST's kit properly then. In a single target situation, helios, aspected or not, is a waste of MP over bene 2, for starters

If I say am healing far easier in noct and using less mp than I do with dirunal in a single situation how is that not playing the kit properly its more of that maybe yes I cant play dirunal properly which ok I agree but I certainly can play the kit perfect in noct.

[MintnHoney]

Having the stances does creates an illusion of having the choice of playstyle, but we’re basically just switching tools around... so no, especially when what we’re using remains pretty much unchanged almost entire time (includes how we DPS, cards usage, etc).

Unfortunately, when every scoop of ice cream is basically the same flavor, the only way you can have any difference, even if subtle, is alter the way the ice cream is delivered.
Let's say AST is vanilla ice cream. For me, Nocturnal was the dark chocolate-dipped waffle cone to Diurnals churro bowl; both are good, though many would flock to the churro bowl for the way it adds that extra savory sweetness to the creamy confection and the time spent into making it presentable. But for as unexciting as it may be, I've always preferred that crispy waffle and sharp dark-chocolate to enhance that simple, refreshing vanilla.

It's just a shame that many healers lately have shown a tendency to break their cones and bowls when they don't even have to handle them that carefully. For efficiency and cost-effectiveness, I suppose it would only be a matter of time until all scoops are forced into styrofoam bowls and plastic spoons, so as not to ruin the the full course meal that is the rest of the team.

...All that being said, thank you for your explanation on the nuances that Nocturnal and Diurnal sects both bring.

[IceBlueNinja]

Unfortunately, when every scoop of ice cream is basically the same flavor, the only way you can have any difference, even if subtle, is alter the way the ice cream is delivered.
Let's say AST is vanilla ice cream. For me, Nocturnal was the dark chocolate-dipped waffle cone to Diurnals churro bowl; both are good, though many would flock to the churro bowl for the way it adds that extra savory sweetness to the creamy confection and the time spent into making it presentable. But for as unexciting as it may be, I've always preferred that crispy waffle and sharp dark-chocolate to enhance that simple, refreshing vanilla.

It's just a shame that many healers lately have shown a tendency to break their cones and bowls when they don't even have to handle them that carefully. For efficiency and cost-effectiveness, I suppose it would only be a matter of time until all scoops are forced into styrofoam bowls and plastic spoons, so as not to ruin the the full course meal that is the rest of the team.

...All that being said, thank you for your explanation on the nuances that Nocturnal and Diurnal sects both bring.

Amen , you know what lets just enjoy our noct stance play till it is gone then just transfer to sage if needs be , who know maybe like noct ast (which is cool)but just more better. I hope and will laugh if SE does force the need to have 1 barrier and 1 healer and does make mechs be heavy on shield so that the all so mighty regens become incompetent , if am rarely bored and play whm and get an ast that go dirunal it just makes me so annoyed now ofc I get another whm partner there is no argument there on double regens then but with ast, why do I need you to do regens too when I can already do it , I like you to apply migitation(in noct) then ill top off the remaining damage with regens of my own (plentary + med 2 or rapture everyone is full hp again oh and asylum if needs be too which is to me better than cu because it +10% heal increase for any other class who has heals where as ast is stuck in one place and its bye if its move even though we kept that specific sect ability and lose the other) then we both can get back to our happy dpsing. I bet as I said like (10 times+ ) if they didnt let dirunal regens work with whm regens, then regens would not be so overrated as it always is (insert a sephiroth best villian of all ff here which aint really true).

[Rilifane]

I hope and will laugh if SE does force the need to have 1 barrier and 1 healer and does make mechs be heavy on shield so that the all so mighty regens become incompetent

I'm pretty sure that's exactly what will happen because all the healers here that have healed everything from leveling dungeons to alli raids to savage and some even ultimate with mitigation and tank gear ranging from non-existent to great are clearly not competent enough to deal with a prog-like healing requirement because they have never progged anything and obviously never had to deal with shields being mandatory to survive.
Oh wait.

[ty_taurus]

Unfortunately, when every scoop of ice cream is basically the same flavor, the only way you can have any difference, even if subtle, is alter the way the ice cream is delivered.
Let's say AST is vanilla ice cream. For me, Nocturnal was the dark chocolate-dipped waffle cone to Diurnals churro bowl; both are good, though many would flock to the churro bowl for the way it adds that extra savory sweetness to the creamy confection and the time spent into making it presentable. But for as unexciting as it may be, I've always preferred that crispy waffle and sharp dark-chocolate to enhance that simple, refreshing vanilla.

It's just a shame that many healers lately have shown a tendency to break their cones and bowls when they don't even have to handle them that carefully. For efficiency and cost-effectiveness, I suppose it would only be a matter of time until all scoops are forced into styrofoam bowls and plastic spoons, so as not to ruin the the full course meal that is the rest of the team.

...All that being said, thank you for your explanation on the nuances that Nocturnal and Diurnal sects both bring.

In other words, even if Nocturnal Sect's impact on playstyle is minimal at best, you're starving for any amount of uniqueness. I can understand that, though for AST specifically, I'd argue the cards do a lot more to keep AST feeling very different to WHM even if they heal the same way (Not to say the current cards are anything to be happy about, but at least the structure is still there).

My perspective is that because Nocturnal Sect is not that impactful on playstyle, losing it doesn't feel like the loss of something structurally core to AST's identity. In fact, as someone who mained AST through HW and SB, I never really liked the Diurnal vs Nocturnal aspect to their healing and felt it was actually watering down AST from the very beginning. I always wanted it to do something other than just be the WHM 2.0 or SCH 2.0 healer.

Now, there are many reasons to be concerned about the future of the healers in general. They've yet to actively improve the healing experience or really say anything of substance about the ShB healer reception, but I personally believe there are more ways to make AST better from dropping Nocturnal Sect and Diurnal Sect than there are ways for it to get worse. I'm not saying it will magically be better than it ever has been before because I don't believe that for a second, but I feel like it will either get somewhat better, or it will remain in largely the same spot. I feel like you'd need to actively try to make it worse at this point.

In short, for me, this is something I've wanted since the beginning. It's all about what we do from this point moving forward that counts.

[ZedxKayn]

If I say am healing far easier in noct and using less mp than I do with dirunal in a single situation how is that not playing the kit properly its more of that maybe yes I cant play dirunal properly which ok I agree but I certainly can play the kit perfect in noct.

I'm just saying that cause you mentioned using Aspected Helios to heal a tank, which is not a good thing to do and will make you use more MP than necessary when you complain about MP issues...

[ForteNightshade]

If I say am healing far easier in noct and using less mp than I do with dirunal in a single situation how is that not playing the kit properly its more of that maybe yes I cant play dirunal properly which ok I agree but I certainly can play the kit perfect in noct.

Because if you were playing Diurnal, or even AST itself, properly, it wouldn't be? My friend mains AST and is pretty damn good at it. Wanna know what virtually 99% of her MP goes into? Malefic/Gravity. In dungeons, she barely even looks at my HP bar and in raids/trials, ED and Star do almost all the work with the occasional regen if needed. There is no denying Diurnal is simply better.