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  1. #31
    Player
    Liam_Harper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    3,470
    Character
    Liam Harper
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Listrella View Post
    i'm glad they made it harder, a relic should not be something easily gotten
    I don't see the difficulty. Lv50-60 Alliance raids, PotD, StB Fates are all extremely easy.

    I'm all for interesting grinds. Eureka at least handled that well in that the zones had some danger and form of progression, it just had other issues that they gradually ironed out by Hydatos. Spam 51 old Alliance raids is just a bland uninspired chore for the sake of grind.

    The logic behind the relic grind has gone a bit wonky too, with the first 3 stages being practically free hand-outs into a sudden long grind this patch, instead of evenly spacing it out. They also went from having an alternate path, which for some reason was more efficient than playing the current expansion content, into suddenly changing their mind and cutting off the alternate path by requiring Bozja progress, then from there adding a step that's done entirely outside of Bozja in old content.

    Finally it's worth noting we got no new Bozja zone. Eureka had 4 unique zones and a raid, while Bozja has 1 small zone and 2 raids. As nice as the raids are, overall it's a cut in new content and instead we're just getting old alliance raids as filler. Honestly, I'd much prefer Eureka right now.
    (10)

  2. #32
    Player
    Edgedy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    155
    Character
    Aurion Pax
    World
    Exodus
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Liam_Harper View Post
    I don't see the difficulty. Lv50-60 Alliance raids, PotD, StB Fates are all extremely easy.

    I'm all for interesting grinds. Eureka at least handled that well in that the zones had some danger and form of progression, it just had other issues that they gradually ironed out by Hydatos. Spam 51 old Alliance raids is just a bland uninspired chore for the sake of grind.

    The logic behind the relic grind has gone a bit wonky too, with the first 3 stages being practically free hand-outs into a sudden long grind this patch, instead of evenly spacing it out. They also went from having an alternate path, which for some reason was more efficient than playing the current expansion content, into suddenly changing their mind and cutting off the alternate path by requiring Bozja progress, then from there adding a step that's done entirely outside of Bozja in old content.

    Finally it's worth noting we got no new Bozja zone. Eureka had 4 unique zones and a raid, while Bozja has 1 small zone and 2 raids. As nice as the raids are, overall it's a cut in new content and instead we're just getting old alliance raids as filler. Honestly, I'd much prefer Eureka right now.
    Fate drop rate is around 1 in 40. SE didn't 'really' give us an option how to do this content. It's Syrcus Tower, Void Ark and Rabanaste. That's about it. Followed by Delubrum.
    (5)

  3. #33
    Player Wrestlefire769's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2021
    Posts
    121
    Character
    Hel Sonofraiser
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Listrella View Post
    i'm glad they made it harder, a relic should not be something easily gotten, it should be something you have to work for, not something everyone has within a week of the relesae.
    I have a term for that -- it's called a sub sink.

    And here's the dumbest part about it: If past expansions are any indication, that only will get you into the mid and upper 80's.

    To me, if you really want to justify the difficulty, you almost should make this a combination (and a far stronger one than the "small advantage" you got in HW) with 6.x.
    (4)

  4. #34
    Player Reap00's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    998
    Character
    Riamara Skye
    World
    Marilith
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 100
    We all saw this thread coming. If you recall a few months back people complained incessantly that the relic was to easy to obtain. What happened to the grind? They gave you a grind now. Have fun.
    (2)

  5. #35
    Player
    Jade3173's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    139
    Character
    Ayis Luola
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Bard Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Liam_Harper View Post
    They also went from having an alternate path, which for some reason was more efficient than playing the current expansion content, into suddenly changing their mind and cutting off the alternate path by requiring Bozja progress, then from there adding a step that's done entirely outside of Bozja in old content.
    apologies to people who are enjoying bozja, but what I just quoted screams to me that there wasn't enough people in bozja to warrant the dev time spent on it so they had to backtrack and throw the relic in there. I'm not against having bozja style content, but maybe the dev team needs to have more realistic expectations of how many people are actually going into that for bozja itself and not progressing relic.

    as it stands, my relics are stuck at i500. I've seen what it takes to grind the next steps outside of bozja, wouldn't mind doing them really, but I'm not going to add to the "successful" stat of bozja. All Square has to do is decouple the next quest from bozja story and I'd be all over getting my DNC relic
    (3)

  6. #36
    Player
    Vahlnir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Tent In the Middle of Nowhere
    Posts
    9,647
    Character
    Elan Centauri
    World
    Diabolos
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Jade3173 View Post
    apologies to people who are enjoying bozja, but what I just quoted screams to me that there wasn't enough people in bozja to warrant the dev time spent on it so they had to backtrack and throw the relic in there. I'm not against having bozja style content, but maybe the dev team needs to have more realistic expectations of how many people are actually going into that for bozja itself and not progressing relic.

    as it stands, my relics are stuck at i500. I've seen what it takes to grind the next steps outside of bozja, wouldn't mind doing them really, but I'm not going to add to the "successful" stat of bozja. All Square has to do is decouple the next quest from bozja story and I'd be all over getting my DNC relic
    Honestly, it just comes down to their biggest design issue since the start of the game, and that is content longevity. Almost everything they release has no staying power or future relevance. It's as though they can't fathom the idea that people need to be incentivized to do things...in an MMORPG. It's all about that carrot at the end of the stick. The dev team seemingly never got that memo.
    (3)
    Last edited by Vahlnir; 02-04-2021 at 05:56 AM.

  7. #37
    Player
    Cirque-it's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Posts
    69
    Character
    Alma Dancing
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 87
    Quote Originally Posted by Reap00 View Post
    We all saw this thread coming. If you recall a few months back people complained incessantly that the relic was to easy to obtain. What happened to the grind? They gave you a grind now. Have fun.
    I LOVED the last build up!! I never complained about there not being a grind!
    (1)

  8. #38
    Player
    Cirque-it's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Posts
    69
    Character
    Alma Dancing
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 87
    Also in general.. if you want to say.. "THis step costs 100 hours"

    Fair enough... but then make it 100 hours for EVERYONE and remove the RNG... make it 200CE crystals but the drop rate is 100%
    (1)

  9. #39
    Player
    Vahlnir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Tent In the Middle of Nowhere
    Posts
    9,647
    Character
    Elan Centauri
    World
    Diabolos
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Cirque-it View Post
    Also in general.. if you want to say.. "THis step costs 100 hours"

    Fair enough... but then make it 100 hours for EVERYONE and remove the RNG... make it 200CE crystals but the drop rate is 100%
    Personally, I'd have loved to have another use for my Poetics. Now they only buy gear for me to trade for GC seals. I would gladly pay 1000-2000 just for a single memory.
    (4)
    Last edited by Vahlnir; 02-04-2021 at 09:04 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida View Post
    Personal Housing
    While I cannot give a specific date on when personal housing will be implemented, I can say that prices will be completely separate from free company housing, and, naturally, far more affordable.

  10. #40
    Player
    Lauront's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Amaurot
    Posts
    4,449
    Character
    Tristain Archambeau
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Liam_Harper View Post
    Finally it's worth noting we got no new Bozja zone. Eureka had 4 unique zones and a raid, while Bozja has 1 small zone and 2 raids. As nice as the raids are, overall it's a cut in new content and instead we're just getting old alliance raids as filler. Honestly, I'd much prefer Eureka right now.
    I believe the more visible and structured relic acquisition pathway that Eureka led to, with its flaws being gradually ironed out, also helped them achieve higher sub retention than otherwise even as the game approached the lull preceding next expansion - it also had particularly high engagement in Japan but also decent clear rates in NA and EU. Yes, that was probably partly helped by a certain other competitor not doing too well at the time, but it provided a form of fairly enjoyable, repeatable content to fill the time with. As things currently stand, I've got my doubts that Bozja is going to accomplish anything like that, particularly as they're not addressing the design flaws it has in the way they did with Eureka. Anyway, I agree with your point on grinds being fine provided they're actually interesting.
    (3)

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