Multiple Houses

[Almagnus1]

Focusing on one of the things, and hypothetically speaking, if we are looking at ending housing for the micro FCs (that is, FCs that have 3 members or less) as IMO FCs that have less players than the number needed to create the FC shouldn't have a house, we need to look at why a player wants to create the micro FC in the first place. Speaking for myself, I would be inclined to have a micro FC if I was actually playing multiple characters on a server as having that swap space is insanely useful. Likewise, given how locked down gardening is with most FCs, I imagine enough players would like to garden but they'd need to have a house so they can cross garden. Then there's the workshop, and while (honestly speaking) I've got enough stuff to do in game so haven't really looked into it much beyond helping others craft stuff, I imagine for some they'd like to make use of the voyages without having to get permission to launch it, or having to negotiate with other FC members to go farm a specific node to get a desired drop.

That's kinda where the suggestions for letting all alts on the same server have access to the same personal house the server (and for that matter, letting the grandfathered in houses appear on each character that's on the same server), that negates one of the reasons for the micro FC. Same can be said for having a public garden system (real world example is https://www.fuhlsgarden.de/ btw). Workshop public access seems like that would need to be tied with us players getting something like a GC mobile squadron headquarter (as that makes the most sense for us getting an airship house), and we'd need to do that as a collaboration with Galrond Ironworks or Skysteel Manufactury. And if we're going to be building one airship... we might as well be able to build out a fleet of them so they can run missions for us - which provides a reasonable way for players to get access to the workshop outside of the FC (with enough work put into it). The other advantage to that system is if airship had required maintenance that was funded by gil, it would bring in a much needed gil sink too.

Speaking of gil sinks, attaching a maintenance cost to the house (functionally a weekly rent cost) that will condemn a house when it's unpaid and bar anyone from entering it (and thus making it unable to reset the AFK demo timer), but also allows you to prepay out like a month or two in advance. Players should get moogle mails when the prepaid rent expires, and also when a rent payment is missed so they are aware of missing payment. While this is also a mechanic from LotRO's housing system, it would also add in a much needed gil sink to FFXIV, as there are not enough gil sinks in FFXIV IMO - which is why I think it's needed in FFXIV.

That's a few suggestions, but it also (hopefully) sheds some light into why we can't just go straight to stripping houses from players and must instead tread a bit of a windy path before we can seriously look at that option.

[Almagnus1]

They've got a major housing update already in the works. We know it's coming after every world has completed its Ishgard Restoration so hopefully that means 5.5.

I missed that one, you got a link to it?

[Sauteed]

Speaking of gil sinks, attaching a maintenance cost to the house (functionally a weekly rent cost) that will condemn a house when it's unpaid and bar anyone from entering it (and thus making it unable to reset the AFK demo timer), but also allows you to prepay out like a month or two in advance. Players should get moogle mails when the prepaid rent expires, and also when a rent payment is missed so they are aware of missing payment. While this is also a mechanic from LotRO's housing system, it would also add in a much needed gil sink to FFXIV, as there are not enough gil sinks in FFXIV IMO - which is why I think it's needed in FFXIV.

I do not think a weekly/monthly 'rent' cost is a good idea, but it is not the worst I've seen floated around. But also Yoshi P. has stated they do not want that for their housing system. If we want to take a wider look at things, let's take a look at the gil faucets spewing untold amounts of gil into the economy as well. They are quite numerous. We're really at a "supply does not meet the demand" place in terms of what's going on with housing. And yes, I agree we should not be stripping housing away from anyone who legit earned their houses. I'm a player that runs an active FC, and have 1 personal private house. I worked hard to get what I got, and if I were capable of getting more (within the rules of the game of course) I'd go for more too, and gladly blist anyone who advocated taking away a shred of what I earned. And I'd probably take pictures and post them to various discords to let people know how I feel about it which may be toxic but it is many times over more toxic to berate and insult a player for playing the game in the first place. I am not a multi-house owning/grandfathered in/look-what-I-got type. But I am 100% more on the side of those types than a single person who advocates taking away anything from another player and absolutely disgusted with the development team behind this raging dumpster fire of an in-game housing system.
-edit stuff
I went over a post someone made about the idea that the answer the dev team had for this current housing crisis was to release 3 wards which happened in the middle of the night for the majority of the player base of this game(yes the majority is not in JST believe it or not), and they were gone in moments after the servers were online for most worlds.. if not completely bought and gone, relocated from and stuck with the dreaded timer of legend(which is a whole other can of worms to kick around). I was one of the few who managed to get in with a reasonable queue time, and got a medium I was able to relocate to from a small I had. Honestly, I feel bad for people without. I also, did not have a house for a while when I started, auto-demo was on pause at the time as well, but when it came back, i was able to get a small (Goblet 9, yeah the most unpopular plot in the game where I camped against maybe 30 others before many just went to bed. I was there for 8.5 hours before I "won" if you can call it that). It could have been worse, but I met some of the nicest people i have ever met in an MMO that night, some of which I still speak to to this day, tho they play much less now. I can't help but wonder if housing was an issue that drove them from playing more.

I started a Free Company with a mish mash of people I met shortly after. We did not have a house, but I said hey I'll spend the time and gil to camp a house, if you guys really want it, and they did ofcourse. I got us probably the 2nd most undesirable plot in the game, a goblet 59. I loved these houses tho, I won the FC house camping against 2 automated players, which I took screenshots of and still have to this day. The FC went their separate ways for reasons, and I quit playing so gave leadership to someone else. I came back in January of this year, no house, and just a bit of gil I had left over. I camped the most unpopular LB spot and won that and relocated since, and have another FC altogether with more than I had before I quit playing to begin with. And I would LOVE to get more, but I'd do it legitimately just like I did it every time before, with a separate account, but I refuse to pay more to "enjoy" this nightmare of a system all over again. That is why I advocate for instanced "improved apartments". That is in my eyes, the only real solution forward and the just discontinue adding wards altogether. I'm kind of half entertaining the idea of quitting playing once and for all anyhow, because of how utterly ridiculous this development team has handled this housing situation. It's a disaster, and there is no denying it. The hours upon hours I alone spent with the few houses I've had have left a mark on me, a VERY real bother as it were. I was sick of clicking after the first 5 minutes, but I've done various things to kill the tedium, like queue up for roulettes while camping, gone out to eat and came back to camp a little more, etc. Every single aspect of the house obtaining process SUCKS. Big time. Worst system of any mmorpg I have ever seen in my life, and I'm nearing 40, and played a TON of mmorpg's in my time. I cannot think of 1 "positive" aspect of the ward system that "justifies" the negatives we are experiencing in this game in regards to the housing. And I've thought on this. Lots. I have seen maybe 12 people in the entirety of my time in this game randomly run through a housing district that were not members of an FC idling outside their FC. There is no neighborhood feel. None.

This is without doubt, one of the absolute WORST reasons to continue with the ward system as it is. "Neighborhood feel". Sure, if you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor. No new taxes. And whatever other lie and deflection that can be invented to make the sell. Honestly, can we see a legitimate back and forth between SE and a panel of players that are not die hard SE loyalists and not hand picked Kotaku "gaming journalists" as to why this system is allowed to fester as it is?

[Jojoya]

It is a massive problem that SE needs to deal with in some form, but what kind of perk would you suggest letting FC's have? How would the shell FC's be kept from obtaining those as well? The whole system; as it stands; is something the devs can probably look back and say "well hindsight is 20/20". I think a first step should definitely be increasing housing supply whether through an "improved apartment" system or just open the flood gates on wards and create many times the amount of wards there are now.

First, take rewards out of house ownership when not everyone gets to own. Move those rewards elsewhere. That alone would reduce demand for houses if SE doesn't plan to enhance the instanced housing system.

Add in rewards that are unlocked by FC members doing content together. Blizzard had done this with WoW guilds but screwed up the system by tying guild ranks and guild member reputation into completing solo content instead of doing group content as a FC.

With respect to making gil, that's a tough one because any time gil is involved there will be someone trying to abuse it for personal gain (was another problem seen in WoW's guild system). How do FCs invest their gil back into their members? Add in ways to get those things without spending gil would be a possible solution. Our FC looks at the massive number of company credits we have but there's little to spend them. Adding more desirable items to the list of what can be purchased with the credits would help.

I missed that one, you got a link to it?

It was in one of the interviews YoshiP did just before last week's Live Letter. The FFXIV reddit discord has the translation (with a link to the original interview) in their translations channel. You'll have to scroll back quite a ways to get to it since the Live Letter translation is the most current info in the channel.

I do not think a weekly/monthly 'rent' cost is a good idea, but it is not the worst I've seen floated around. But also Yoshi P. has stated they do not want that for their housing system.

If they're going to stick to the limited ward system, I think it's an excellent idea. Players are far less likely to buy a house they aren't actively using if they have to keep paying a recurring in-game fee to keep it. It also acts as an additional gil sink the game desperately needs. Any fee could scale based on the house size so it's very affordable on a small but sizeable on a medium or large.

As for things they do or don't want for the system, that can change over time. Maybe they feel differently 6 years later after seeing how the system has worked out.

[Almagnus1]

I cannot think of 1 "positive" aspect of the ward system that "justifies" the negatives we are experiencing in this game in regards to the housing. And I've thought on this. Lots. I have seen maybe 12 people in the entirety of my time in this game randomly run through a housing district that were not members of an FC idling outside their FC. There is no neighborhood feel. None.

The biggest problem the ward system has are the negatives being so overwhelmingly bad that they overshadow any positives the system may have. Until those negatives get fixed... this is going to be the sentiment with a lot of players. That's also why I'm for pulling stuff like the workshop and gardening OUT of the housing system.

[Catstab]

Ima have to stop you there. I have 2 FC's in my server that own more then(sic) 10 FC houses. 1 HAS 11 the other 13. That right there seems to be more then(sic) 8

The 24 FC houses you describe are held by a minimum of 3 players on 24 characters. So you've discovered that 3-24 players are leading FCs that own houses. Groundbreaking. You might want to read up on housing works before you suggest changing how housing works.