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  1. #1
    Player
    Spartan_Aoues's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Posts
    50
    Character
    Spartan Aueos
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Absurdity View Post
    For warrior and gunbreaker it is a dps increase to use your aoe combo on 2+ mobs.

    Keen Edge -> Brutal Shell -> Solid Barrel = 3 GCDs for 900 potency total, Demon Slice -> Demon Slaughter = 2 GCDs for 400 potency per enemy hit. So let's assume you do 6 GCDs with atleast 2 enemies. Your single target combo would deal 1800 potency in damage and your aoe would deal 1200 potency per enemy in the same amount of time for a total of 2400 potency in dps. It becomes a bit more complicated if we factor in cartridge spenders but generally you want to prioritise your Gnashing Fang combo for 1-3 mobs, at 4+ mobs Fated Circle will deal more dps.

    I'm not too sure about paladin or dark knight but even there you can safely assume that at 3 or more enemies your aoe will deal more damage in total. This obviously changes at lower levels when you only have access to 1 aoe ability with relatively low potency.
    After big pulls you done wait to kill 2-3 mobs, the dps can prob kill it on your way to the next packs. its better to just mobe on and grab more. unless u need to wait for cds or healer mana is low.
    (0)

  2. #2
    Player Mhaeric's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Vancouver, BC
    Posts
    2,141
    Character
    Mhaeric Llystrom
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 97
    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan_Aoues View Post
    After big pulls you done wait to kill 2-3 mobs, the dps can prob kill it on your way to the next packs. its better to just mobe on and grab more. unless u need to wait for cds or healer mana is low.
    As a DPS main, I hate this. Don't do it. Killing moving targets is a pain in the socks especially if there's still 2-3 of them since they'll likely be spread out and you're forced into single target. The only two exceptions that I would recommend to this are a) if there are only ranged dps in your party since movement doesn't impact those jobs as much although mobs spreading out still impacts AoE and b) if you know that the dps can kill the remaining mobs before they start moving to follow you I.e. waiting until the absolute last moment when only a single hit or two will kill all of the remaining mobs.
    (6)
    Last edited by Mhaeric; 10-08-2020 at 03:18 AM.

  3. #3
    Player
    Spartan_Aoues's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Posts
    50
    Character
    Spartan Aueos
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Mhaeric View Post
    As a DPS main, I hate this. Don't do it. Killing moving targets is a pain in the socks especially if there's still 2-3 of them since they'll likely be spread out and you're forced into single target.
    Quote Originally Posted by Xiaoki View Post
    Yeah, this is stupid and annoying. This only works if you have 2 Ranged Physical DPS.
    I understand your frustration, as most combo skills will be useless while on the move, especially if u are casting. As a tank i get it but pay attention to the situation. If there are 2-3 mobs that are 10% health, there is no reason to maximize combos u can just use single target or use aoe skill that are not tied to mob pos. If done right by the time you pick the next pack dps will have already killed all mobs. Also if you are moveing the mobs will have a longer/staggerd auto attack pattern, making it much easy for healers in range, also it makes buffs like regs more efficient.

    As a rule you want to always be pulling not 2 much to wipe not to little that healers it not challenged, make sure you push ur team to be better.
    (0)

  4. #4
    Player Mhaeric's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Vancouver, BC
    Posts
    2,141
    Character
    Mhaeric Llystrom
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 97
    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan_Aoues View Post
    I understand your frustration, as most combo skills will be useless while on the move, especially if u are casting. As a tank i get it but pay attention to the situation. If there are 2-3 mobs that are 10% health, there is no reason to maximize combos u can just use single target or use aoe skill that are not tied to mob pos. If done right by the time you pick the next pack dps will have already killed all mobs. Also if you are moveing the mobs will have a longer/staggerd auto attack pattern, making it much easy for healers in range, also it makes buffs like regs more efficient.

    As a rule you want to always be pulling not 2 much to wipe not to little that healers it not challenged, make sure you push ur team to be better.
    No. You're potentially wasting dps buffs by pulling like that and killing mobs on the move is a pain for melee and casters. Anyone looking for tanking advice, please ignore anything he said above. Most of it isn't good.
    (1)

  5. #5
    Player
    Spartan_Aoues's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Posts
    50
    Character
    Spartan Aueos
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Mhaeric View Post
    No. You're potentially wasting dps buffs by pulling like that and killing mobs on the move is a pain for melee and casters. Anyone looking for tanking advice, please ignore anything he said above. Most of it isn't good.
    relax dude its not bad advice, you dont need the damage buffs, or combos to kill mobs that are 10% health in fact if you wanted you could just used ur ranged attack and by the time the next pack is set ranged will have already killed the stragglers, if not when the next pack is set you can use aoe and cleave stragglers as well.
    (0)

  6. #6
    Player
    Xiaoki's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    76
    Character
    Balar Avagnar
    World
    Ultros
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan_Aoues View Post
    After big pulls you done wait to kill 2-3 mobs, the dps can prob kill it on your way to the next packs. its better to just mobe on and grab more. unless u need to wait for cds or healer mana is low.
    Yeah, this is stupid and annoying. This only works if you have 2 Ranged Physical DPS.

    For Melee DPS the mobs will be moving in and out of melee range. You could use Sprint to go faster but then you will be going faster than the mobs and your Sprint will run out before you get to the last pack of mobs and be wasted.

    The problems should be self evident if you have Caster DPS.
    (7)

  7. #7
    Player
    aodhan_ofinnegain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    545
    Character
    Aodhan O'finnegain
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan_Aoues View Post
    For max reductions as close to the end of the cast bar as u can get(depends on latency) you want the buff icon to appear before the cast bar is finished to register(depends on the attack some attack have a longer animation and can be mig later i think)
    This is a not a good means to using cooldowns, outside of maybe timing tank invulns in Savage or Ultimate. Really you should not use cooldowns that close to the boss finishing its cast, but instead try to use your cooldowns early, in advance of tankbusters, as mitigating auto attacks before tankbusters and after can help healers immensely. Also the sooner you use them, the sooner you get them back off of cooldown. Of course pre popping your cooldowns comes with learning a fight first.

    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan_Aoues View Post
    After big pulls you done wait to kill 2-3 mobs, the dps can prob kill it on your way to the next packs. its better to just mobe on and grab more. unless u need to wait for cds or healer mana is low.
    This is by far the worst thing you can do as a tank in a dungeon, it's just stupid and frustrates melee and casters for no reason, and even Physical ranged too to some degree. A good tank will commit to the pull they have made, and will wait until the mobs are dead before proceeding to the next pack. You prevent doubling the sprint duration received from being out of combat or prevent the use of Peleton from physical ranged, and the increased HP / MP ticks out of combat too, all the while dps are trying to kill the mobs that keep getting yoinked out of their range.

    Be a good tank don't do this in dungeons.
    (4)
    Last edited by aodhan_ofinnegain; 10-08-2020 at 12:26 PM.

  8. #8
    Player
    Absurdity's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    3,069
    Character
    Tiana Vestoria
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by aodhan_ofinnegain View Post
    This is a not a good means to using cooldowns, outside of maybe timing tank invulns in Savage or Ultimate.
    There are some cases where this is actually a good idea, namely when you know that popping your cooldown as late as possible allows you to mitigate a second mechanic.
    (1)

  9. #9
    Player
    aodhan_ofinnegain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    545
    Character
    Aodhan O'finnegain
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Absurdity View Post
    There are some cases where this is actually a good idea, namely when you know that popping your cooldown as late as possible allows you to mitigate a second mechanic.
    It can happen, but it rarely happens in current content, especially with so many forced tank swaps due to debuffs, in just about every 8 man content, you're just wasting over half of your mitigation.
    (0)

  10. #10
    Player
    Spartan_Aoues's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Posts
    50
    Character
    Spartan Aueos
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by aodhan_ofinnegain View Post
    It can happen, but it rarely happens in current content, especially with so many forced tank swaps due to debuffs, in just about every 8 man content, you're just wasting over half of your mitigation.
    ya if you are tank swapping you done want to pop your cds late as it will be basically useless after the initial damage
    (0)

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